Thought you were gona run different coilies? Should give you more the spax don't seem to give much.
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sburrell's ph1 172 track project (maybe)
- Thread starter sburrell93
- Start date
Thought you were gona run different coilies? Should give you more the spax don't seem to give much.
Aye, forgot about the slotted holes you get in other coilies actually. Meh, still tempted to try it [emoji23] it's something different. Still have my old subframe if it goes tits too.
Seems like a massive effort, not only that I would be concerned about throwing other things out as I think you will struggle to get 4 holes lined correctly,
From what I've worked out (or tried to), the only thing it could affect is the caster if they're not lined up perfect. Any upsets to camber/toe can be brought back into alignment. Could affect roll centres too, but I can't see a mil or two causing that much of an issue if the car is lowered and the wishbone angles are all fucked anyway.
Just fancied trying something a bit different tbh.
I hope you appreciate how difficult this is for me to say on record and it probably won't happen again but
I agree with Fraser.
Ouch, now I feel dirty.
I agree with Fraser.
Ouch, now I feel dirty.
182
He can do the full car for a reasonable price if need be mate lol
I know my mate was going to do it. He's ridiculously clever and particularly good at measuring n s**t.
He decisded it was too much hassle.
My tech teacher was always telling me to KISS. Keep it simple stupid.
Hi [emoji8]
Subframe got a lick of paint at the weekend, so I doubt it'll be getting any sort of alteration done now anyway. I still might try it with the spare I'll end up with just for something to do though.
Gearbox is on a pallet ready to be sent away to get refurbed as well. Should be getting picked up today. Need to get some flywheel bolts and a new clutch and I'll be good to go. Then take the engine out...
Well, I bought a few tyres today...
Think that'll probably do me for the whole of this year! 😂
Think that'll probably do me for the whole of this year! 😂
7R
Cute.
Been a boring Saturday night in looking at various things to buy for this! Thinking about stealing @dann2707's rose joint idea for the rear arb... (Has it made a noticeable difference to yours?)
No idea what to do about coilies either. The Spax RSX ones I ran last year I thought were pretty good (considering what I paid for them), but the rears are knocking now, can't be refurbed, and at 150 or so quid a side for new ones that's out the question! The fronts also don't let me run as much camber as I'd ideally like to, so I want to change them anyway. Been looking into BC's and KW's, but both are 700-800 quid for a set and that's a lot more than I really hoped to spend. The BC's do look like a great setup mind you, and so far not read a bad review about them on here...
No idea what to do about coilies either. The Spax RSX ones I ran last year I thought were pretty good (considering what I paid for them), but the rears are knocking now, can't be refurbed, and at 150 or so quid a side for new ones that's out the question! The fronts also don't let me run as much camber as I'd ideally like to, so I want to change them anyway. Been looking into BC's and KW's, but both are 700-800 quid for a set and that's a lot more than I really hoped to spend. The BC's do look like a great setup mind you, and so far not read a bad review about them on here...
Just a heads up I can supply GAZ golds direct from gaz for £750 inc custom spring rates and delivery
How is £300 out the question for two new rear shocks? But you're considering £800 for a full new set? Seems backwards to me....
Cheers mate. Weighing up options the now but will keep it in mind!Just a heads up I can supply GAZ golds direct from gaz for £750 inc custom spring rates and delivery
I only paid 300 odd quid for the spax in the first place. It's false economy replacing rear shocks at that price when the fronts could go soon too. Plus they don't give enough camber and realistically I should probably be looking at stiffer spring rates now than what the spax have.
Cost just seems an irrelevant point to make then, maybe just my opinion.
I need to get new rear shock for mine, they're £200 and that's just for 2 shocks not a coilover unit like yours so seems cheap to me.
I need to get new rear shock for mine, they're £200 and that's just for 2 shocks not a coilover unit like yours so seems cheap to me.
Nah you're probably right there, I'm just a tight b*****d [emoji23] I had always planned on getting something better than the spax, just not sure what to go for.
Just feels like £800 is a lot to throw into a suspension setup that I've only got some online reviews to go on.
Depends how serious you are. If you plan on doing many track days and even SLS spend more than £800. It'll only benefit you in the long run. All my money is in handling!
Fairly serious, but surely over £800 the only real option is AST's? I ain't quite that serious (or baller) yet [emoji23]
Had thought about SLS for 2017 though so I guess there's no point in cheaping out this year and having to upgrade again.
Had thought about SLS for 2017 though so I guess there's no point in cheaping out this year and having to upgrade again.
cpaterson76
ClioSport Club Member
Supercharged AG 200
You don't need ASTs. Times wise there was no massive benefit over mid range coilovers with the correct spring rating....
I agree with this!
Spring rates, alignment and sort out roll centre is where money should be spent.
Although saying that I can't talk, I conformed and bought a set of ASTs... [emoji48]
Cub.
ClioSport Moderator
You saw mine with ASTs at Blyton. If that helps! Lol!
What would you be classing as mid range mate? KW, BCs etc like I've mentioned, or cheaper? Also any advice on spring rates? I know Fraser upped his on the KWs but I've never looked into figures with this stuff before.
As above, have you got any recommendations for spring rates? I'll take all the advice I can get just now!
As for roll centres, I wish this last group buy Mark is doing was 2 or 3 months down the line, then I might be able to afford it! 😞
Failed to get a lap in it though lol. It looked good...but I'm not sure that's what counts in coilies that expensive! 😂
Gaz GHAs can run springs up to F:500R650. Which is very good for a £500 coilover.
It's really hard to judge spring rates unfortunately as it's preference, in general I think clios respond well to a stiffer rear end, but that's down to me preferring a sharper turn in and having to deal with a more lively rear end.
Track car with a bit of road: in lbs - think it's ÷ 5.47 to find out newtons iirc...
400/450
450/450
450/500
Is where I'd want to be at.
Lbs is what I work in anyway. f**k that kg/mm and N/mm stuff, confuses the life out of me lol!
I'd say I'm the same as you as liking the rear end stiffer. Always had my arb set to it's stiffest setting and kept the damping up high on the back, but the Spax coilies I had were only 342 front and 228 rear (according to ktec anyway). That's full rear coilover units though so I think that makes a difference to the rates.
BC's are the only ones I've found to list spring rates online so far. They have 450 up front and a choice of 225 or 280 on the rear. Seems soft compared to what you'd recommend!
I think that the general consensus with the BCs and the coilovers you spec'd is that people complain that they can't get high enough spring rates for them (but haven't looked much into it tbh)
The rear coilover unit work on a 2:1 motion ratio - I'm confusing myself a little bit in my head though, so I can remember if you'd need twice as hard spring on a platform set up to be equal to a rear coilover set up or the other way round. hey ho.
And if you have a Rarb or your rear beam welded that's essentially doing the job of harder springs, making it roll less. etc so obviously thay should be taken into account.
Yeah, seems like the 280lb ones is as stiff as they go.
Stiffer inboard springs would make sense as they're closer to the pivot point. Is that as simple as doubling/halving the rates for each though? Seems too simple lol. I think it's getting too late for this 😂
cpaterson76
ClioSport Club Member
Supercharged AG 200
I ran GAZ GHAs before switching to ASTs. They were standard spring rates and that was my only concern but as Coilovers go I couldnt fault them and they were generally good and handled knockhill well. I believe the bodies are painted now so they don't tarnish after 2 months use and end up looking 5 years old. Adjustable rear struts so all good for road n track. Rear height drop will be limited as its spring n cup, but not really an issue. I have heard mixed opinions on GHAs but can fault them. My cousin now uses my old set on his Clio at knockhill.
The change to AST is an upgrade and there is no doubt about it. Even on standard road springs the car ran much flatter. After 2 track days and discussions with AST I upgraded to race weight springs, so I now run 90n front and 110n rear, sorry don't know Lbs rating, but roughly translated fu@kn hard front and even Fu@kn harder in the rear and I love it...... Are they really worth 3 times the price of GAZ? Don't know really and that would your decision but tine improvement wise..... No
As a side note I do like the look of BC and Frasers PH1 runs really well on FK.... ( just to confuse things)
Decisions decisions Stuart, but just to clarify, and as Frasers comment, your car and times were very good on your spax. Especially considering you've only done a handful of track days, so why not build the car, refurb or get new rear spax and get another year out of them or until the right deal comes up on the forum??
The change to AST is an upgrade and there is no doubt about it. Even on standard road springs the car ran much flatter. After 2 track days and discussions with AST I upgraded to race weight springs, so I now run 90n front and 110n rear, sorry don't know Lbs rating, but roughly translated fu@kn hard front and even Fu@kn harder in the rear and I love it...... Are they really worth 3 times the price of GAZ? Don't know really and that would your decision but tine improvement wise..... No
As a side note I do like the look of BC and Frasers PH1 runs really well on FK.... ( just to confuse things)
Decisions decisions Stuart, but just to clarify, and as Frasers comment, your car and times were very good on your spax. Especially considering you've only done a handful of track days, so why not build the car, refurb or get new rear spax and get another year out of them or until the right deal comes up on the forum??
cpaterson76
ClioSport Club Member
Supercharged AG 200
varying conversion factors but using the eibach one I run ........
FRONT 514 lb
REAR 600 lb
REAR 600 lb
Cheers Craig that's gave me a fair bit of food for thought. I know I definitely won't be going with anything as expensive as ASTs now anyway (or springs rates that stiff!)
Good point you've made about the Spax though. They did to work well for a fairly cheap(ish) coilover setup. My only issue with them is how little camber they give. Even with camber bolts maxed out I had about -1.5 degrees and I'm still wearing the outside edges of tyres, so I was hoping to get that up to around -2.5 degrees and that was half my reasoning for wanting some different coilovers with slotted bolt holes on the fronts. That, and it'd be nice to have new ones for building the new shell back up with!
I've emailed BC (leaning towards these if anything tbh) and they said they can now do varying spring rates for the rear apparently which seems good as my only gripe with what I found online was that they seemed to have fairly soft rear springs.
I think for now though building the car back up with the Spax (as they are) maybe isn't a bad idea, and I'll look into new suspension in a few months time. Focus money on other bits just now.
cpaterson76
ClioSport Club Member
Supercharged AG 200
I run 2.5 and take the inner edge out of the tyres, so maybe 2 will be the happy medium....
Done some stuff tonight. Got the bumper, headlights, slam panel etc all off. Air con pipes, condenser and pump removed then got the alternator out. Slowly starting to strip it down ready to remove the engine.
Tomorrow's plans are to drain the fluids, get the radiator and hoses all off, then get the inlets etc all off and start unplugging everything. Slow progress so far but the (slightly) longer nights are making it more bearable to work on the car.
Gearbox should hopefully be back with me by the end of next week too meaning everything will be ready to do the engine swap, so fingers crossed this weekend is dry to get the engine bay prepped and painted.
Tomorrow's plans are to drain the fluids, get the radiator and hoses all off, then get the inlets etc all off and start unplugging everything. Slow progress so far but the (slightly) longer nights are making it more bearable to work on the car.
Gearbox should hopefully be back with me by the end of next week too meaning everything will be ready to do the engine swap, so fingers crossed this weekend is dry to get the engine bay prepped and painted.
Little bit more progress again last night. Coolant drained, radiator off and hoses moved out the way. Need to get some way of looping out the heater matrix when it goes into the new shell.
Got all the wiring disconnected too ready to lift out with the engine. Thanks @Fraser.J. for pointing out the easier way to do this!
Hoping to get this Friday afternoon spent painting the engine bay in the new shell. Once that's prepped it'll be time to start building it back up. Get the subframe and stuff back on and swap whatever else over that I can while the engine is still in there.
Got all the wiring disconnected too ready to lift out with the engine. Thanks @Fraser.J. for pointing out the easier way to do this!
Hoping to get this Friday afternoon spent painting the engine bay in the new shell. Once that's prepped it'll be time to start building it back up. Get the subframe and stuff back on and swap whatever else over that I can while the engine is still in there.
Leave the heater. I really don't understand why people remove it!
You reckon? I was undecided on what to do, it just seemed the easier option since there would be less to swap over!
Yeah leave it. We did it without cos of the heated screen but it was only going to be track and nothing else. And even then for a car that will get used on the road too just fit it.
I would probably leave mine in if I didn't have the heated screen, but the screen is f**king awesome!
Would maybe look at the lightweight heater, but then again there would not much weoght difference between the standard one and the lightweight one and the standard one does a much better job!
Would maybe look at the lightweight heater, but then again there would not much weoght difference between the standard one and the lightweight one and the standard one does a much better job!
I've got a heated screen mate, wouldn't have been considering not transferring the heater matrix without that! I've heard good things about these screens haha will be good to see how well they work.
Oh sorry must of missed that, yeah thought you had an alternative but missed what it was...
Really really well! Normal mist disappears in seconds. I went out in a rain storm the other night (Henry) with my polycarbs, roof scoop holes in the floor (forgot to put grommets back in after re shell) - the foot wells were pretty flooded but the screen stayed completely mist/fog free.
Was very impressed.
The website recommends using two looms etc but I wired it all into one bigger ampage relay and seems to do the trick, saves a bit of time etc.
I'm actually not sure I ever mentioned it! Came with the shell when I got it.
Sounds awesome! I'll be wiring it into two looms I think as it's been half wired up already. Have you got a link to the instructions/guide/whatever on the website?
