Track car Attempt 2

[Goodj]

I've driven MX-5's back-to-back, with stock and lightened flywheels.

It'll sound faster if you're sat revving at a standstill but you wont pick up revs on the move any quicker, really, not once you're past 2nd anyway. It's not a turbo.
But gear changes can now be done like you're trying out for Initial D, as revs will drop like lead bricks.

 

[mr bognor]

I've driven MX-5's back-to-back, with stock and lightened flywheels.

It'll sound faster if you're sat revving at a standstill but you wont pick up revs on the move any quicker, really, not once you're past 2nd anyway. It's not a turbo.
But gear changes can now be done like you're trying out for Initial D, as revs will drop like lead bricks.

Ok not what I was thinking then as I thought the car would rev faster .

 

[Goodj]

Ok not what I was thinking then as I thought the car would rev faster .

Well, it will, just not when you've got the weight of the car loaded against it. You might see an improvement in 1st and second, but it'll be marginal.
To an unrealistic extreme, think how bikes can rev up and down in a millisecond... that's a light flywheel.

 

[Djw Dave]

Great little project car this, looking forward to seeing it on track.

 

[scullyg40]

A lighter flywheel is worth it for sure. You reduce your rotating mass, so instead of the power needed to rotate that first, you put it on the tarmac. I've had one on my Polo G40, and I could definately feel the difference. It's basiccally the same as mounting lightweight wheels. :wink:

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

Surely the power needed to rotate a little flywheel is nothing compared to turn wheels with tyres on them after they've been through a gearbox and a final drive.

 

[scullyg40]

It all depends on the weight and the diameter. :wink:

 

[mr bognor]

And as I have just sorted out my Youtube account and to get in the mood a vid of last August at the Ring in the old SAXO VTS .

 

[mr bognor]

I will be doing a track day at Brands Hatch in May but im unsure on the Noise the car is making .

The car has a Cobra quad exhaust system , 100 cell sports cat , toyo sports de cat manifold so does anyone know what noise level I will be at as the car does not sound that loud .

Brands hatch have a limit of 105Dba .

Also I only have an open face helmet so do I need a full face helmet as I have been reading you do .

Regards

 

[mr bognor]

I got a few more bits done at the week end .


I fitted a towing strap to the front of the car .











Then I checked the noise level and it is at 79 dB





Then as I had some gold heat reflective tape left I used this on the induction pipe .





And to finish off as the car is a soft top you need a full face helmet so my OMP open face helmet will be no good so I purchased a Agrius one .

 

[mr bognor]

I will be looking to change the wheels and tyres next month but I’m just thinking what will be best .


The car is for track use only so looks do not matter but I’m after some lightweight wheels that will go with some track day tyres .


The car as it is has the below set up from the factory


Front 185/50/15

Rear 215/45/16


The wheels I’m looking at are the Team Dynamics pro race 1.2 but am unsure what size to go for .


I’m thinking to go for a square set up of 15 inch wheels all round but what tyre size would be best do you think .


Front 205/50/15

Rear 205/50/15


Or


Front 195/50/15

Rear 205/50/15


Or


Front 195/50/15

Rear 225/50/15


What do people think will be best .


Thanks for your thoughts .

 

[JB21]

I'd say being RWD you want wider at the rear and if they'll take 225 without rubbing then go for it, I've just gone 225 all-round with the Celica.

 

[Goodj]

yep, maximum rubber on the back, less up front.

It'll help prevent you going backwards into gravel

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

Personally I always wanted to try 195/50-15 all round. Cheap and available tyres for one, also let's you rotate your wheels. I found that the car doesn't have nearly enough power to get power oversteer but actually when it does go it's quite progressive so there's not a requirement for extra grip to prevent slip at the back IMO.

I think my 1 series snaps harder than my MR2 did.

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

Think the MR2 race cars use 195/50-15 fwiw

 

[mr bognor]

I have done a few things from the last update to the car and it is now getting there .

The new clutch and lightweight flywheel and gearbox oil have now been installed so the car is driving again after a new MOT , insurance and tax .


First up was to install a 100 cell sports cat





Old cat





The old cat I will put back in next year for the MOT as I don’t think the 100 cell unit will pass .


I then installed a Destak unichip that plugs in to the ECU as a piggy back unit .





Then removed the passenger air bag but retained the top cover so all looks stock and no big hole in the dash .






Then changed out the steering wheel for a OMP 300mm unit .





Next was to install the rear towing strap .




Then on the changing the rear brakes for some EBC yellow stuff pads and re greasing the sliders pins .







And a quick sticker for where it will be going in August




On the test drive the car under power was pulling to the left and feeling not great at all and very skittish on the road so after a quick look the rear near side control arm ball joint has failed causing the tracking issue .





Also the IACV was playing up and the revs all over the place on idle but a quick clean has sorted this .


So to sum up im booked in for Brands hatch next Wednesday 16/05/18 and I have a car that is not running right and not finished to how I was planning it would be for the first track day .

I have Ordered replacement Hard race rear control arms that will be in tomorrow and some braded brake lines and RBF660 fluid that should be in on Monday but it will be a mad dash to get every thing finished off in time .

Nothing like some last minute problems to get you excited 

 

[mr bognor]

So with only three dyas until Brands Hatch track day the new rear control arms arrived just in time .


New Hardrace adjustable rear control arms





Old and new





And installed








Car now drives spot on again but could do with a tracking set up .


I fixed the Idle air control valve with a good clean out and now the idle is spot on again .


I also install a Varley Red top race battery ( 5 Kg vs the OEM 13.3 Kg unit )








I also installed the front EBC Yellowstuff pads and re greased the front slider pins .


I have coming today some Goodridge braided brake lines to go along with the Motul RBF 660 to finish off the car so far .





So it looks like I will make Brands Hatch after all but it would have been better if everything had gone more straight forward but where would be the fun in that .

 

[Djw Dave]

Nothing like some last min fettling before a TD.

Hope all goes well on the day

 

[mr bognor]

Yes not what you need but its all fun and games

Nothing like some last min fettling before a TD.

Hope all goes well on the day

 

[mr bognor]

My Goodridge braded brake lines arrived and I was going to fit them last night and do a brake fluid change and flush for the Motul RBF 660 .



Three bleed nipples came off / open fine but the last one was rounded off and the first line I tried to remove for the brake pipes was not going anywhere so I thought it best to pack up and call it a day as a snapped pipe / nipple would mean not making Brands Hatch tomorrow so I will have another go with some heat and other tricks at the week end after the track day .

I did manage to bleed the three other corners of the car with the Motul RBF 660 so at least there is some good fluid in there .




Car seems to be running well as I have taken it to work today for a quick shake down so we will see how we get on tomorrow with a 50 % finished track car .

 

[mr bognor]

So did the first track day of the year at Brands Hatch for an evening session in the MR2 and below is the report of how the session went with some good and bad points .

It is about an hour from work and the Mrs met me at work and we had a quick stop to get some food and a coffee .







We then got to Brands Hatch and signed on and did a noise test ( 94DB )












Looking at the other cars there I would class us in the slower category at this stage as there were some very nice cars there .





After the safety briefing we had two sighting laps and what a great track this is with some great turns and undulation going up and down .


As said before the car is only 50 % finished and is running stock eco tyres and 15 year old stock suspension .


After one lap it was clear that the tyres were totally out of there depth and loosing grip very quickly so I had to be very gentle on the throttle as slip was very easy to get in to with too much throttle .


The videos have the Go pro mount making a noise that is annoying im afraid so I will need to look at this for next time .


Video Link to my first go below .


https://youtu.be/AzO6ngsU3Ak


The car felt great with regards to the chassis and feel of the car and even the power was ok for this track but the tyres really gave up after lap 1 but then I know this would be the case but was still great fun .


Video Link to my last laps below .


https://youtu.be/7MAB2eM-yGU


I was starting to really enjoy myself and getting to know bits of the track .


Lucy had the second session and being new to RWD and mid-engine had a bit of a moment on the below vid at 5 minutes in .


https://youtu.be/oAm_pbJW8HA


We had to come in to the pits and she lost a bit of her confidence but she went back out for some more laps later in the evening .


So to sum up it was a great track session and the car felt great up to a point but was hampered by the stock suspension & tyres so it will be good to go back with the car finished off to see how it gets on them as I think it will be much better and a lot quicker .

Last pic of the destroyed road tyres 

 

[Darren S]

Interesting choice of track car that - your missus at least did a controlled 'off' and simply didn't plough into other cars, or the tyre wall. Tell her that we all have to spin at least once, in order to experience a track day fully!

My ex-wife had one of these new when this shape came out. I personally thought it could have done with a bit more power - say 30-40bhp on top of what they came with as stock. Would have been nice to see the T190 lump in there as a factory option?

The seating position and gearchange were great imo - but it was easy to get the rear-end a bit unwieldy - especially in the damp. That was on a new car too, so your 15+ year old suspension setup might be lacking when pushing on and could be a contributing factor as to why the tyres are getting battered so quickly?

Good effort on making progress with the consumables and stuff. Hopefully it will serve you well for many more track days.

 

[mr bognor]

I did say every one has a moment or two and I have a few moments yesterday that were getting close .

I will run the 1ZZ this year and then look to swap out the engine for the 2ZZ 190 BHP unit and with the suspension and tyres all done this should be a fun quick little thing .

Interesting choice of track car that - your missus at least did a controlled 'off' and simply didn't plough into other cars, or the tyre wall. Tell her that we all have to spin at least once, in order to experience a track day fully!

My ex-wife had one of these new when this shape came out. I personally thought it could have done with a bit more power - say 30-40bhp on top of what they came with as stock. Would have been nice to see the T190 lump in there as a factory option?

The seating position and gearchange were great imo - but it was easy to get the rear-end a bit unwieldy - especially in the damp. That was on a new car too, so your 15+ year old suspension setup might be lacking when pushing on and could be a contributing factor as to why the tyres are getting battered so quickly?

Good effort on making progress with the consumables and stuff. Hopefully it will serve you well for many more track days.

 

[Darren S]

I did say every one has a moment or two and I have a few moments yesterday that were getting close .

I will run the 1ZZ this year and then look to swap out the engine for the 2ZZ 190 BHP unit and with the suspension and tyres all done this should be a fun quick little thing .

Apologies - I'd only read the 2nd page about the mods made to the car - I didn't read Page One. Seems like you made big inroads with tweaking it already.

The paint looks to be in very good condition for the age and given that its red. Is the bodywork pretty tidy too?

 

[mr bognor]

Yeah a few bits have already been done but the main bits are still to be done .

The body work is relay nice and dare I say too good for a track car as it has been loved its whole life with so much service history but its new life will be on track and may pick up the odd battle scar I have no doubt .

Apologies - I'd only read the 2nd page about the mods made to the car - I didn't read Page One. Seems like you made big inroads with tweaking it already.

The paint looks to be in very good condition for the age and given that its red. Is the bodywork pretty tidy too?

 

[mr bognor]

So after the first track day the car is back in the garage up in the air and looks to have taken Brands Hatch well if melting the stock tyres .





Im planning on doing Castle combe on the 16/07/18 then Brands Hatch on the 31/07/18 then off to Germany to the Ring for 5 days 06/08/18 – 10/08/18 .





I did want to do Thruxton but the car is at 94Db so will not pass the 90Db noise limit .





With the upcoming track days in mind I have just ordered a big raft of suspension parts to go on before July that are the below units .





Meister R CDR+ coilovers



Hard race rear rose joint lower arms



Hard race rear rose joint trailing arms



Front wishbone with poly bush inserts and ball joint



Innovative 75A track solid engine mounts



Innovative 75A track solid gearbox mounts



Team dynamics pro race 1.2 light weight wheels 15 inch front and 15 inch rear



New track rod ends



New inner tie rods



Nankang AR1 tyres 195/50/15 front 205/50/15 rear



That should transform the car from its last track day and will be the last parts this year before a 2ZZ 190 BHP Toyota T sport engine is fitted early next year .

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

Last time I mention it. I would honestly go and have a look round a 2zz car and have a go in one. In theory they sound like a super OEM solution and a cheap way to get +50hp.

The reality is most people I've seen do the swap, and sell the car after chasing problems. The people that keep them are either happy with half a job or end up spending 4x the value of the car getting it right (or lucky to not have issues).

1zz can have 150hp with some NA tweaks and just enjoy it IMO.

 

[mr bognor]

Food for thought then but what are the common problems that come up .

I was thinking about getting rouge motorsport to do the full conversion with the gearbox upgrade and manifold as well .

Not cheep but then fewer problems you would think ???

Last time I mention it. I would honestly go and have a look round a 2zz car and have a go in one. In theory they sound like a super OEM solution and a cheap way to get +50hp.

The reality is most people I've seen do the swap, and sell the car after chasing problems. The people that keep them are either happy with half a job or end up spending 4x the value of the car getting it right (or lucky to not have issues).

1zz can have 150hp with some NA tweaks and just enjoy it IMO.

 

[mr bognor]

At the weekend I had another go at installing the Goodridge brake lines as last time there were not coming off at all .


New Goodridge braded brake lines .





Old and new














One of the bleed nipples was rounded and stuck on but with some p oil and some heat and a bit of filing it came out without snapping .





I also adjusted the handbrake cable as it was 10 clicks to clamp on and now at 5 clicks .

 

[mr bognor]

At the weekend I got some time to fit some of the new parts to the car .


First up was the rear trailing arm and rear lower arm .


I replaced them with some Hardrace uprated units








New vs old








And installed








Next was to replace the front wishbones with new uprated units .


New pollybush units








New vs old








Installed





Then it was on to the front inner and outer tie rods and track rods .


New unit .





New vs old





And installed








I also got some TPI lightweight wheel nuts ready for the new wheels and looked to see how light they were vs the OEM units .





OEM vs TPI




OEM nut





TPI nut




So that is just under 1 Kg saving of un sprung weight

 

[mr bognor]

And now the post man had just delivered some more shiny stuff

 

[Djw Dave]

Excellent effort. It'll be a completely different car next time out.

 

[Akay]

Nice - just got one of these myself. What boss did you go for if you dont mind me asking? Heard a lot of them mess with the self cancelling @mr bognor

 

[mr bognor]

Excellent effort. It'll be a completely different car next time out.

We are booked in for Castle combe on the 23/07/18 and then back to Brands hatch on the 30/07/18 the off to the Ring on the 06/08/18 so it will get a proper test
I want to see how it is compared to how it was first time out so that will be interesting to find out .

The car still needs lightweight wheels , Nankang AR1 semi slick tyres , and solid engine mounts then I think we are done for this year .

Alan

 

[mr bognor]

Nice - just got one of these myself. What boss did you go for if you dont mind me asking? Heard a lot of them mess with the self cancelling @mr bognor

I got the Momo unit and it fits fine but there is no mounting for the horn or any self cancelling for the indicators so think you may be restricted in your options .

Is your one std at the moment ?

 

[Akay]

I got the Momo unit and it fits fine but there is no mounting for the horn or any self cancelling for the indicators so think you may be restricted in your options .

Is your one std at the moment ?

Ah. Expensive as well for it to not be plug and play. Does it come with the airbag resistor? I thought the self cancelling thing was the yellow plug which goes through into the boss.

Its standard apart from a stainless catback. Just bought some Tein springs and long term planning to 2ZZ. Love to drive it though.

 

[mr bognor]

Ah. Expensive as well for it to not be plug and play. Does it come with the airbag resistor? I thought the self cancelling thing was the yellow plug which goes through into the boss.

Its standard apart from a stainless catback. Just bought some Tein springs and long term planning to 2ZZ. Love to drive it though.

My one did not come with that yellow plug ?

Its not too much of a problem as I will put the OEM steering wheel back on for MOT time next year .

Were you not tempted by coilovers or is the car more for road use ?

 

[JB21]

Coming along nicely with some lovely new shiny bits, decent track tyres is were you'll see the biggest improvement, it will feel like a different car.

Are you going to Japfest Donington by the way?

I've booked tickets but in a race now to replace the whole rusted rear end of the 190 before the 30th June.

 

[Akay]

My one did not come with that yellow plug ?

Its not too much of a problem as I will put the OEM steering wheel back on for MOT time next year .

Were you not tempted by coilovers or is the car more for road use ?

Not at the moment, using it on the road primarily but I will do a track day in it I reckon. Yellow plug is on the squib when you pull the wheel off.

 

[mr bognor]

Coming along nicely with some lovely new shiny bits, decent track tyres is were you'll see the biggest improvement, it will feel like a different car.

Are you going to Japfest Donington by the way?

I've booked tickets but in a race now to replace the whole rusted rear end of the 190 before the 30th June.

Don't think I will have the time for Japfest tbh so will just have to stick to the plan .

Regards