Surrey Rolling Road 2014 Results

[MarkCup]

It worked for my 200. Gained 10 bhp from when I got it from a year of abuse and a switch to decent fuel.

The ST did OK yesterday on it as well

 

[Kyle 86]

yeah missed yours too mate, I had to get to a breakers in Rochester before they closed at 13.00 to pick up an engine for the misses car. So luckily got to run my car early and got off at 11.30ish. The chap who run it said he thinks timing



IIRC it's been live mapped by RS Tuning so should have a decent map on, I'm going to have to look back through the history now.



good to see you too mate, your face was a picture when you made 190+, like a kid at Christmas, lol.

Hahaha I was mega shocked. Your cup looks lovely & being behind you made me think about replacing the 197 boot badge with a 200 one. Looks good

 

[Cub.]

Bobby. Which cams are they bud, and have you got proof they were fitted? I assume you bought the car already cammed and didn't cam it yourself?

Cam should add between 8-15bhp depending on loads of factors. So if your engine was only making 150 standard, then 165 with cams is a 'good result' as such. Thing is, if it was only making 150 then it was a far from healthy engine when standard. I'd do some investigating, as that is a low result for a healthy cammed f4r bud, I am afraid.

 

[Martin.]

Here's the other *35i engine. Both very similar, but mine isn't as tidy or smooth.

 

[Fantom]

The mini GP made 195.0

Great result Kyle

 

[jicholasnackson]

v800mjh, it dawn on me yesterday, ofc BMW will map differently to enable similar perforamnce in the lower ev ranges due to weight differences.

 

[Fantom]

I meant yours, not the minis lol

 

[Bobby.]

@Bobby. Which cams are they bud, and have you got proof they were fitted? I assume you bought the car already cammed and didn't cam it yourself?

Cam should add between 8-15bhp depending on loads of factors. So if your engine was only making 150 standard, then 165 with cams is a 'good result' as such. Thing is, if it was only making 150 then it was a far from healthy engine when standard. I'd do some investigating, as that is a low result for a healthy cammed f4r bud, I am afraid.

This is the problem you see mate, theirs not a receipt/proof for the cams but the previous owner was so convinced it had cams that he got it dyno runned to see what it made and it made 191 then! And that was on a Set of Dyno Dynamics rollers as well. That's why I can't see how theirs a 24bhp difference, I have since then replaced the KTR IC for a standard airbox with a ITG panel filter and a decat for a standard cat but I can't see that making much difference.

Its quite possible that it is just a unhealthy engine like you say, it could be timing, could be a lot of things, really I need to pull it apart and check the cams and timing etc. I'll have to do it in due time just to see what's what.

im on my phone atm but when I'm on the computer I'll put the old and new graph up.

 

[Fantom]

Bobby my phase 1 supposedly ran 181bhp by a previous owner but only made 161bhp when I ran it. I know you can't compare different rollers but it seems a big difference also

 

[Cub.]

This is the problem you see mate, theirs not a receipt/proof for the cams but the previous owner was so convinced it had cams that he got it dyno runned to see what it made and it made 191 then! And that was on a Set of Dyno Dynamics rollers as well. That's why I can't see how theirs a 24bhp difference, I have since then replaced the KTR IC for a standard airbox with a ITG panel filter and a decat for a standard cat but I can't see that making much difference.

Its quite possible that it is just a unhealthy engine like you say, it could be timing, could be a lot of things, really I need to pull it apart and check the cams and timing etc. I'll have to do it in due time just to see what's what.

im on my phone atm but when I'm on the computer I'll put the old and new graph up.

Highly likely to be a 'fictional' first RR to be honest mate - either operator tweaking or over reading. I suspect it isn't running cams unfortunately, in which case it's quite a healthy stock engine at 165. Who did you buy it off? Still a massively tidy Cup you have mate, and at least you a good reliable benchmark to base future mods on.

 

[Martin.]

Bobby and Fantom. What rollers were your previous power runs done on?

Some rollers are obviously known to over read. K-Tec's ecpecially.

 

[mr bognor]

Only if you drive it for me mate

Quite happy with 234bhp/ 225lbsft from the family wagon

Decent power from the Z4 (3.0 bi turbo?) mr2 turbo (let me know if you would like to come to the ring Alan ;p) , the mountune fiesta ST - it must be pretty nippy, good all round package! A ITB'd clio that made good power and sounds lovely.

thanks again Jon for another well organised year at SRR, hopefully Charlie sorts out another venue in time for next year.

 

[Bobby.]

Bobby and Fantom. What rollers were your previous power runs done on?

Some rollers are obviously known to over read. K-Tec's ecpecially.

It was run at a place called Carton Miller. Not heard much about them myself.

 

[Saner]

Corten-Miller, haven't had direct dealings. Some mixed impressions of there tuning work, but nothing about the RR being over the top

 

[dmallett]

@Bobby. I doubt its running cams, i remember seeing your car for sale and not being convinced.

Rollers do make a massive difference though, as many found out with there cammed cars at the rolling road we use.


Did AlexW run? interested to see power there compared to Rindy's.

 

[mr bognor]

The only pic i took and it was not even my car LOL

Still have a thing for the Honda or Pete FN2 should i say

 

[Chip-mk1]

Highly likely to be a 'fictional' first RR to be honest mate - either operator tweaking or over reading. I suspect it isn't running cams unfortunately, in which case it's quite a healthy stock engine at 165. Who did you buy it off? Still a massively tidy Cup you have mate, and at least you a good reliable benchmark to base future mods on.

Or it was a good engine, had cams fitted, mapped dangerously, made good figures initially and now the bad mapping has killed it and it's way down on power due to engine internal damage. Seen a few of those on 438s in particular now.

 

[Bobby.]

Corten-Miller, haven't had direct dealings. Some mixed impressions of there tuning work, but nothing about the RR being over the top

Thats the one!

@Bobby. I doubt its running cams, i remember seeing your car for sale and not being convinced.

Rollers do make a massive difference though, as many found out with there cammed cars at the rolling road we use.

I have been thinking maybe it doesn't have uprated cams, that would explain 167bhp, but then how would it of made the 191bhp before? Can't see the other rollers over reading that much.

 

[AlexW]

Did @AlexW run? interested to see power there compared to Rindy's.

Yep I did.

I've done mods since Rindy's so can't compare at all! I made 67.4HP and 114LBFT at Rindys, on a completely standard engine.
Yesterday I ran 76.8HP and 140LBFT with an extra 10k or so, Decat, no backbox etc and intercooler.

See below...

 

[Bobby.]

Or it was a good engine, had cams fitted, mapped dangerously, made good figures initially and now the bad mapping has killed it and it's way down on power due to engine internal damage. Seen a few of those on 438s in particular now.

The thing is, the Cams would of been fitted long before it was dyno'd to make 191. Your theory could still apply though.

 

[Chip-mk1]

The thing is, the Cams would of been fitted long before it was dyno'd to make 191. Your theory could still apply though.

Would they?
I've no idea as not familiar with his car.

 

[Cub.]

Or it was a good engine, had cams fitted, mapped dangerously, made good figures initially and now the bad mapping has killed it and it's way down on power due to engine internal damage. Seen a few of those on 438s in particular now.

I'm sure I've seen one of those aswell. Not sure where though

The thing is, the Cams would of been fitted long before it was dyno'd to make 191. Your theory could still apply though.

Is it eating any oil? Showing any other signs of engine wear?

 

[Fletcher]

Untitled by fletcher10, on Flickr

Dissapointed with my RR results TBH Charlie thinks something is restricting it, because it just drops off. It made 171.5bhp last time at SRR.

 

[dmallett]

Theres only one way to find out really Bobby. and thats opening it up to see whats in there I guess! Unless someone can tell from looking at the map?


Nice AlexW ! I love your car

 

[Chip-mk1]

Untitled by fletcher10, on Flickr

Dissapointed with my RR results TBH Charlie thinks something is restricting it, because it just drops off. It made 171.5bhp last time at SRR.

The drop off is the dephasor switching off I would think.

Its 2.5 bhp different to last time. That's the same reading really as runs vary that much back to back sometimes.

 

[Kyle 86]

Heres my graph from yesterday
Not a great pic as for some reason my tapatalk dont give clear pics from my S4

 

[Bobby.]

Would they?
I've no idea as not familiar with his car.

basically the previous owner, thought the car was cammed by a previous owner as it felt quicker than his last 1*2, so convinced he decided to get it dyno'd to see what it's makes, then it made 191bhp, that was only done in October last year, I then bought it in December. When it made the 191 it did have a KTR induction kit and decat and since then I've put the standard airbox with an ITG panel filter and a cat back on but I can't see that making much difference. roll on to yestarday and it made 167bhp lol.

Heres the for sale thread from when I bought it with graph print out in it.

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?725717-Clio-172cup-191-6bhp-2118s-caged-%A33000

I'm sure I've seen one of those aswell. Not sure where though

Is it eating any oil? Showing any other signs of engine wear?

No it doesn't use any, it does seems really healthy to me.

 

[Fletcher]

The drop off is the dephasor switching off I would think.

Its 2.5 bhp different to last time. That's the same reading really as runs vary that much back to back sometimes.

I hadn't thought about the dephaser switching off. All new belts and dephaser fitted in Sep 2013. Also had PMS AC delete, and matched inlets fitted since the last run, so was hopping for 172bhp or more TBH.

 

[Bobby.]

Theres only one way to find out really @Bobby. and thats opening it up to see whats in there I guess! Unless someone can tell from looking at the map?

That would solve it once and for all, plus I can make sure the timings correct as well. I will do it at some stage.

 

[Kyle 86]

That would solve it once and for all, plus I can make sure the timings correct as well. I will do it at some stage.

Take it down to mike at MWM and he will have a look at it for ya bud

 

[Chip-mk1]

You might be able to spot a cam swap by looking in the oil filler cap, but it depends on what cams it is. If it's 197 ones for example you aren't going to spot it. Same for piper repro ones but engine dynamics for example are visibly different.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I hadn't thought about the dephaser switching off. All new belts and dephaser fitted in Sep 2013. Also had PMS AC delete, and matched inlets fitted since the last run, so was hopping for 172bhp or more TBH.

Harsh reality is matched inlets make very little difference and AC delete makes nothing measurable if it's run with the aircon turned off anyway.

Maybe the timing now isn't as good as it was before the belts done. Can't be out by much though to be only a few bhp short.

 

[Bobby.]

Take it down to mike at MWM and he will have a look at it for ya bud

I can do the mechanical stuff myself mate, could get him to check the mapping though.

Is it possible to see if it's got aftermarket cams from looking through the oil filler hole?

 

[Bobby.]

What about cat cams chip? You can cast your eye over it at Bedford this sat if you like

 

[terryc101]

Had a good morning as usual at SRR, spoke to a few people who's names I have no idea on lol. Didn't take the 172 as it has a slight coolant leak so convinced my dad to run his S500/our towing car.

 

[AlexW]

Your merc was one of the funniest of the day I have to admit. Right from "Is it running?" to the dyno run and not being able to hear when he was doing a run!

 

[Sir_Dave]

Aren't mini GPs rated at over 200hp?

Yup. 218 lol.

Bit narked really, had an Insp2 done 2 weeks ago (with a new s/c belt) and well, after getting only 194bhp Charlie said i should check it. Had a look when i got home and its stretched/lost tension already. Doh.

I hadn't noticed the complete lack of puff from 5-7.5k as the max speed i hit on the way to work is usually about 30 lol.

Little hoon on the way back from SRR suggested that it is poorly, although still not exactly lethargic!!

Getting a new belt fitted tomoz

 

[Chip-mk1]

What about cat cams chip? You can cast your eye over it at Bedford this sat if you like

We can all have a peer in and guess mate. Lol.

 

[Craig.]

Least your getting it sorted Dave, it's an awesome car I love the look of it.

 

[barnesautos]