I am thinking about starting a new career at the grand age of 30 yrs old!! I want to learn how to fix / load software / build PC's as a job and also use my knowledge for private work! I just dont know the best courses to study or where to study them. I have heard about the A+ courses for mircosoft...and then there is the debate whether to learn about PC's or Mac's.....PC's def have a bigger office base! so if anyone could give me some advice that would be great! I am based in Surrey by the way if anyone knows good courses at Surrey college's! thanks!
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I.T. Courses
- Thread starter Adam69
- Start date
ChrisR
ClioSport Club Member
Best way to start a career in those kind of areas is to start off in a simple first/second line support role and work up from there. People groan about first line but tbh it depends on the company.
I know places where it's a damn good start for you career and others where first line would be hell on earth.
Things like A+ and Network+ will help you get your foot in the door at these lower starting levels, but once you've a year or 2 behind you then I think they count for pretty little. You then start moving up to the bigger MS/Cisco certs, or whatever you can do in your particular area.
If you're wanting to do it evenings/part time at first then loads of places run these kind of courses although might be worth buying the books and stuff and see how much of it you know or how hard you find it. A lot of people self study these and just go and pay for the exams.
Saying that I've pretty much got f**k all in the way of certifications so they are most definitely not the be all and end all
First question to that would be, what do you want to do in 'IT'? Just saying IT is rather vague, it's a pretty latge field so you'd need to decide what kind of thing you wanted to do.
I know places where it's a damn good start for you career and others where first line would be hell on earth.
Things like A+ and Network+ will help you get your foot in the door at these lower starting levels, but once you've a year or 2 behind you then I think they count for pretty little. You then start moving up to the bigger MS/Cisco certs, or whatever you can do in your particular area.
If you're wanting to do it evenings/part time at first then loads of places run these kind of courses although might be worth buying the books and stuff and see how much of it you know or how hard you find it. A lot of people self study these and just go and pay for the exams.
Saying that I've pretty much got f**k all in the way of certifications so they are most definitely not the be all and end all
First question to that would be, what do you want to do in 'IT'? Just saying IT is rather vague, it's a pretty latge field so you'd need to decide what kind of thing you wanted to do.
i did a couple of years in a small company which blagged me into a first line 'proper' IT job (network engineer) - i started as an admin person and volunteered to do the IT with my knowledge that i had from a hobby basically.
as above i got pretty lucky with the job i got, they want me to do my MCSA
at my current job it's just me and my boss in the IT Dept. so I get lots of chances to learn stuff
as above i got pretty lucky with the job i got, they want me to do my MCSA
at my current job it's just me and my boss in the IT Dept. so I get lots of chances to learn stuff
only way youl do that is working for a small pcshop no one builds pcs from components that works in IT they get built by factory workers in factories mainly
also forget about earning any big amounts of money those adds that say get this qualification and you will earn 40k are b****cks complete b****cks
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
To even get a foot in the door you need to be quite qualified and/or have experience.
It's not something you can just walk in to.
I don't have any MS qualifications and I'm not too sure if I want any (mcse etc). It's becoming outdated and everything's moving over to the virtualisation side of things.
It's not something you can just walk in to.
I don't have any MS qualifications and I'm not too sure if I want any (mcse etc). It's becoming outdated and everything's moving over to the virtualisation side of things.
first line support= receptionist really you dont leave your seat to do anything and ern ooh 14k a year
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
LOL for that amount of money you're talking crazy skill and knowledge.
Do top CISCO technicians even earn that much?
Programmers can earn a fair whack I guess.
Do top CISCO technicians even earn that much?
Programmers can earn a fair whack I guess.
Virtualisation might be the in thing but you still have AD Domains on them so that doesn't really out date MCSE
Microsoft certs are more useful than just being a qualification - it teaches you the right way of doing things
I've been in the industry for 10+ years and I'm still learning lots every day - I still buy books for reference, I still set up test Virtual networks for pissing about on. If you want to be good at it you gotta put the hours in.
Get a feel for the whole range of IT then specialise in what you find the most interesting. You still need a good knowledge of all types of systems tbh not just PC's.
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
You're dead right.
I'm just trying to convince myself I don't need to finish reading the books.
Truly is the most boring thing on earth, but thank god I'm working with it daily so I get continuois knowledge on the subject. I only maintain and adminsitrate, didn't set it up.
I'm just trying to convince myself I don't need to finish reading the books.
Truly is the most boring thing on earth, but thank god I'm working with it daily so I get continuois knowledge on the subject. I only maintain and adminsitrate, didn't set it up.
Why? Whens the right time?
I hate IT.
Wasted 2 years at college studying it. Maybe I am bitter and jealous.
Wasted 2 years at college studying it. Maybe I am bitter and jealous.
Virtualisation might be the in thing but you still have AD Domains on them so that doesn't really out date MCSE
Microsoft certs are more useful than just being a qualification - it teaches you the right way of doing things
I've been in the industry for 10+ years and I'm still learning lots every day - I still buy books for reference, I still set up test Virtual networks for pissing about on. If you want to be good at it you gotta put the hours in.
Get a feel for the whole range of IT then specialise in what you find the most interesting. You still need a good knowledge of all types of systems tbh not just PC's.
it teaches you A way to do things not THE way
the ammount of times things dont happen the way they are written in ms training books is unreal even in a classroom environment where they run the courses day in day out things happen differently every time.
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
^ This.
A lot of variables MS don't consider. The best way to learn, as always, is by experiencing it everyday in the field. Troubleshooting problems that aren't bog standard defaults.
A lot of variables MS don't consider. The best way to learn, as always, is by experiencing it everyday in the field. Troubleshooting problems that aren't bog standard defaults.
Mountune Tractor
This.
At this recession hit time I would look into healthcare, energy, public services. IT has been a major loser in the recession.
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
Lol it's totally false advertising.
all this talk of mcse being outdated etc thats because they have routes like the MCITP Enterprise admin and MCITP Server admin ( I am both)
they are much better routes to go, you need to do a mix of 4 specialist exams then do the enterprise exam to get this status, the exams are a mix of virtual labs (have to be able to perform the tasks in a time period) and 30 odd questions so the knowledge needs to be there also.
As said start low and get a good basis for what you enjoy and are capable of, so many people blow their own trumpet and are so off tune with their abilities its untrue.
I started as a modern apprenctice at 17 fixing minor software/hardware glitches, and ferrying paper around the buildings.
2 years later finished my 3 year apprentice scheme (worked super hard) and moved on to a support firm where I built bare bone machines so learnt hardware inside out, and went and supported school networks and machines.
2 years after that I moved onto a slightly more senior role doing the same but much more involved networks and solutions.
Spent 2 years there and moved to a company that has a network with 2700 sites, 3 data centres and 21 agregation points and over 100 services some including video upload services, exchange 2007 for over a million users.
I sit close to being a technical manager and earn nicely and the salaries can be had but you have to work hard and earn your worth, but I have only recently put my skills onto paper with my 7 MS certs as mentioned above.
hope this gives u an idea of what can be had, but be aware some friends who are same age (just 25) are sat in jobs struggling to get 20k max!!!!
Thanks
they are much better routes to go, you need to do a mix of 4 specialist exams then do the enterprise exam to get this status, the exams are a mix of virtual labs (have to be able to perform the tasks in a time period) and 30 odd questions so the knowledge needs to be there also.
As said start low and get a good basis for what you enjoy and are capable of, so many people blow their own trumpet and are so off tune with their abilities its untrue.
I started as a modern apprenctice at 17 fixing minor software/hardware glitches, and ferrying paper around the buildings.
2 years later finished my 3 year apprentice scheme (worked super hard) and moved on to a support firm where I built bare bone machines so learnt hardware inside out, and went and supported school networks and machines.
2 years after that I moved onto a slightly more senior role doing the same but much more involved networks and solutions.
Spent 2 years there and moved to a company that has a network with 2700 sites, 3 data centres and 21 agregation points and over 100 services some including video upload services, exchange 2007 for over a million users.
I sit close to being a technical manager and earn nicely and the salaries can be had but you have to work hard and earn your worth, but I have only recently put my skills onto paper with my 7 MS certs as mentioned above.
hope this gives u an idea of what can be had, but be aware some friends who are same age (just 25) are sat in jobs struggling to get 20k max!!!!
Thanks
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
Over a million? Wouldn't fancy administrating that!
I know it's rude, but how much do you earn?
I know it's rude, but how much do you earn?
Different in our place then! Pick your position carefully it seems.
ChrisR
ClioSport Club Member
Why I said pic the right company
Plus I'd try and find a role that's not solely sitting on the helpdesk, a lot of entry level desktop support roles are a mix of first and second.1st line at my previous place pays 20+ off the bat, my current place start desktop support guys on 21 which goes up to 30 over 3 years.
True, but all those companies also need IT staff in some way or form...
Question for the guys in the thrad wanting to start out in IT, what kind of salary expectations have you got?
dCi 65 + C2 (<Sold)
F*cksake 1st line that pays 20k? For reading a script? Where abouts is thats like?
Megane 230 F1
Internship at networking company: £18k
Low grade / student engineer at some: £21k
Junior Engineer w/ CCNA: £25k
Engineer w/ CCNP: £30k+
Senior Engineer or CCIE: £40k without much experience (ie, less than five years)
Senior Engineer or CCIE w/ experience: £55k min and keep asking for more.
Having helped carry out interviews for our internships in the past.. I've seen a few who are having a change in career later on in life. If you do it, you must absolutely want it and be totally interested in what you're heading into. You need to have the motivation to study and learn in order to get in the door.
There's a previous thread to this and I refer to mine and others' posts: http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=468952&page=3#45
Low grade / student engineer at some: £21k
Junior Engineer w/ CCNA: £25k
Engineer w/ CCNP: £30k+
Senior Engineer or CCIE: £40k without much experience (ie, less than five years)
Senior Engineer or CCIE w/ experience: £55k min and keep asking for more.
Having helped carry out interviews for our internships in the past.. I've seen a few who are having a change in career later on in life. If you do it, you must absolutely want it and be totally interested in what you're heading into. You need to have the motivation to study and learn in order to get in the door.
There's a previous thread to this and I refer to mine and others' posts: http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=468952&page=3#45
The thing about the ms certs is they teach you a way of doing things but they don't really tell you what you should do when it goes tits. This is where experience comes in obviously.
I hope to get my mcsa/ ccna and then get a promotion to the equivilant of my boss on one of our sites - happy to move location tbh. Once I'm there I'm not sure what I'll do heh, but I'm only young
I hope to get my mcsa/ ccna and then get a promotion to the equivilant of my boss on one of our sites - happy to move location tbh. Once I'm there I'm not sure what I'll do heh, but I'm only young
yes if they have other skills. Hell as a ccna with ccna security i might be lucky to earn £7 an hour.
ChrisR
ClioSport Club Member
I said first line, not script reading, it totally depends on the company how they operate their first line
People seem to think all first liners do is log call, pass it on. Both places I've worked they are required to use their brains a bit and actually work out what's wrong and try to fix it
They wouldn't be paying the money to just read a script.My place desktop support (all of 2 guys lol) is them answering the phones, sorting the problem out on the phone, and if they can't do it either going to see them or having them drop in.
And both places are way down in south devon, one is regional government (where you also get obscene amounts of leave and a nice training budget
) the other a utility company.As for 100k salaries, as a salaried permy job then you're talking pretty top end, most likely pre sales type stuff rather than pure techy.
Contractor roles however that's pretty doable, contractors that did my job a couple of years ago were getting £500 a day (if only they paid me that much
) and see a lot of roles around for £350 a day upwards. But then you've got to take into account job security, not being paid for sick or holiday etc.
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The way I got into an IT career was through an apprenticeship with a local manufacturing company. I stuck with that for 4 years before being made redundant and went from earning about 10k a year at 16 to about 16k a year at 20. When I first started out I already had an interest in computers from school so I got thrown straight into fixing PC's, building network cables, hooking up patch panels, supporting basic end user issues and unlocking user accounts. As time went on I got trusted more and more until it got to a point where I was practically looking after everything myself - from basic user support right up to infrastructure related changes.
When I got made redundant, I found a job with a local IT company thanks to a friend who already worked there. Their customer base was mainly SMB's so I got exposed to a decent range of technologies. Again it was much the same as the previous role except I was field based and had more responsibility and a lot more pressure on me because I was customer facing and had to work to deadlines all the time.
I then moved to my current employer into a first line helpdesk job. Over 2 years I've built my qualifications and progressed my way through the company and up the pay scale. I'm now doing an Infrastructure role focused mainly on security and network configuration. I still get given 3rd line support stuff to do as well but it's mainly centred around switch / router / firewall configuration or infrastructure security.
My next task is to work towards attaining my CCIE: Security accreditation, which I know will be a lot of work but there's huge earning potential. There aren't a lot of employers actually looking for people with that level of knowledge because a lot of the time it's not required. Perhaps only large service providers or companies who outsource to large multi-nationals would be the only ones looking to employ someone full time with such a skill set. However, because there aren't many people who achieve such a high level IT qualification and the experience that goes with it, the salaries reflect this. Also, as a consultant or contractor the earning potential is huge and if that doesn't go too well, working for a service provider full time is always going to earn a decent enough wage.
When I got made redundant, I found a job with a local IT company thanks to a friend who already worked there. Their customer base was mainly SMB's so I got exposed to a decent range of technologies. Again it was much the same as the previous role except I was field based and had more responsibility and a lot more pressure on me because I was customer facing and had to work to deadlines all the time.
I then moved to my current employer into a first line helpdesk job. Over 2 years I've built my qualifications and progressed my way through the company and up the pay scale. I'm now doing an Infrastructure role focused mainly on security and network configuration. I still get given 3rd line support stuff to do as well but it's mainly centred around switch / router / firewall configuration or infrastructure security.
My next task is to work towards attaining my CCIE: Security accreditation, which I know will be a lot of work but there's huge earning potential. There aren't a lot of employers actually looking for people with that level of knowledge because a lot of the time it's not required. Perhaps only large service providers or companies who outsource to large multi-nationals would be the only ones looking to employ someone full time with such a skill set. However, because there aren't many people who achieve such a high level IT qualification and the experience that goes with it, the salaries reflect this. Also, as a consultant or contractor the earning potential is huge and if that doesn't go too well, working for a service provider full time is always going to earn a decent enough wage.
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