Carb 2 injection conversion

[Blue Mule]

So I plan to make that conversion on GT Turbo. The question is - is it worth it?

Whats the advantage of carb, what are the advantages of injection...

Any experiences with that conversion?

 

[steve_rt]

carbs are better than SPI power-wise i believe, you would have to get multi-pt for it to be beneficial. why are you after doing it? ive no experience of it but can imiagine its a fair bit of work, having to put a whole ECU sys in compltete with sensors etc.

 

[Chris_H]

advantages of injection over carb, increased MPG, increased power throughout rev range, increased torque throiugh rev range, increased driveability, ability to change when upgrades are made.

Advantage with carb, er, um its already there I suppose...

 

[Blue Mule]

1980 Renault 5 Turbo had K-Jet, but on GT Turbo they switcht to carbs...dunno why.

Yeah its pretty much hustle doing the conversion, but Ill do it somehow, I contacted Fastchip, they told me parts I need to use...its basically 16V ecu on a GT Turbo...and it can hold up a boost to 1.5 i think..

 

[steve_rt]

nice - what do you do for all the sensors that you need tho e.g. flywheel sensor - are the mountings there already?

 

[Chris_H]

the turbo your reffering to did run Kjet but its very different to the fwd version.

The K-jetter ran a 7.0:1 CR, bhp was 160 @ 6krpm, torque was 154lbft @ 3250 rpm, Garret T2 @ 12.5 PSI. It also had an integrated intercooler and inlet manifold, tubular exhaust manifold converging in a split pulse collector.

These days with EFI its easy to get power and reliably as well.

You will need a 3 BAR Map sensor though.

 

[Blue Mule]

Parts needed for making the conversion are;

- fuel rail
- manifold with injector pockets
- injectors Bosch 0280 150 126
- ignition unit from F7P/F7R
- water, air and TPS sensor
- 16V ecu
- cable harness
- fuel pressure regulator
- 200kPa map sensor
- eprom

and little of time reading http://www.students.tut.fi/~hezekiel/bosch.htmhttp://www.students.tut.fi/~hezekiel/bosch.htm

 

[Chris_H]

get yourself down the scrappies Blue Mule and rob the gear off a Saab turbo.

All MPI, single butterfly TB, high flow multi discharge bosch injectors, they run MAF sensors but get what you can from the saab.

 

[Blue Mule]

What SAAB? Any Turbo?

Anyway, thanks for the advice, Ill consider it...

Just asking - since Renault and Volvo share some parts (and some engines), would it be nicer if i stripped it off from some Volvo Turbo?

Also; which models of SAAB or Volvo have intercoolers? Front mount?

 

[Chris_H]

any saab 900/9000 turbo. The saabs also have good front mount coolers as well, except the 9000 LPTs.

Saabs the way to go, the vauxhall LET boys go for Saab clobber as well. The saab injectors will give any power you ask of them. The standard aero/carlsson is 225bhp and you can run the stock trionic (post bosch lh) to 500bhp.

 

[Blue Mule]

So that injectors wont have any problems dealing with GTTs 120 HP?

So I should go stripp complete electronics from SAAB?

Trionic is SAAB product?

 

[Chris_H]

The Saab injectors even on the slowest 9000 (2 litre NA which is 135bhp) will be fine. The lowest output turbo model is the 175 bhp 2 litre turbo. Any of these injectors will fuel a GTT no bother.

Get what you can, the bosch TB is 60mm in dia I think which is big enough for anything and with EFI wont impose any driveability trouble.

Trionic is Saabs own EFI system and bloody good it is to.

Saabs are also a good source for turbos, all Garrets, well the later ones are licensed to mitsibishi but are garrets with a different name.

 

[Blue Mule]

Hmmm, SAAB solution sound very appealing to me now...))

Ill go surfing on the net for SAAB info...any good tech page?

Off topic - my neighbour has a 9000 turbo, but with a little thunder bolt in yellow trianlge by the drivers door...is that originally from SAAB and what does it stand for?

 

[PaulRobo]

What size intercoolers do the saabs tends to come with? Bigger than a standard GTT i presume??

 

[Chris_H]

saab coolers about 3/4 times the size of the GTT effort. Its nearly as big as the saab radiator.

 

[Ben P]

Had a bried look into 9000s but to be honest there seems to be so many turbo variants it was a little confusing.

Are all the 2.0ltr models the same engines with different states of tune? How much more powerful is the 2.3 turbo?

Any advice if looking to buy one?

 

[Chris_H]

2 litre models, 2 types pre balancer shaft (B202) and balance shaft (B204).

Balance shafts came in 93.

Capacity is 1985cc.

Now you can get them in NA form which is 135bhp, LPT (low pressure turbo) 150bhp and the FPT (full....) which is between 160 - 185bhp dependant on year.

Also depending on year the LPTs may have had an intercooler.

The 2.3 litre (2290cc) models all came with balance shafts and the later NA models came with 146bhp and the turbos where between 200 and 225bhp.

The engines are very good, the 2 litres are very over square 78mm stroke and 90mm bore) and safe to high revs. They can also pump out 500bhp on the stock engine and on the later trionic cars you can run this power without havign to change to fancy management. The 2.3 litres have the same 90mm bore but a 90mm stroke as well, again these are just as good and are easier to get power from.

Are you wanting a buyers guide on what to look for, for an actual car or just a car to rob bits from?

 

[Ben P]

No I was actually thinking of buying one.

For my next car I want something comfortable and fast, as well as having that street sleeper image.

Also I have had some very reasonable insurance quotes on the 9000, obviously the 2.0T has been cheaper.

But ultimately I want something that it is turbo charged and tuneable.

So which models should I be looking at 2.0 FPT and 2.3 ?

 

[Chris_H]

Well the 9000 is the car to have matey, the 900 is a bit naff and the new 9-3s and 9-5s are not a patch on them.

They handle really well, I was really surprised actually.

The body is a bit flexible, but nothing major, you notice it when its cold and you get a bit of creaking if you bump up a kerb for instance. Its like any other big car really.

Comfy but base models or non sporty models are not the interiors for cornering at 3 gs. You dont get comfier for sitting at 120 though.

Anyway rust, the rear arches under the trim go, so check here carefully, the bottom of ther doors rot as well. Take the arch trims off and clean them and wax the metal work up. The door bottoms have a rubber bung int he middle, take it out and allow anything to drain out and poke the drain holes clear, they were painted over with underseal (doh!).

Easy to work on as well actually.

I have the cackest model, 2 litre NA auto, I have had it at a ton 20 but it wasnt going any faster, that was 4 up and with 4 17 inch alloys in the boot! lol

They all have all round discs, coil spring suspension, 15 inch steelies are the worst wheels youll get.

They also come with electric front and rear windows, leccy tilt and slide sunroof and so on.

Interior niggles, bulbs go but easy enough to change but the ones in the switches need a dab of solder to fit. The headlining can sag, in fact mines in my bedroom waiting for me to glue the material back up.

Overall good cars and mine came with a fair few niggles but I sorted them out sharpish. Main prob with my car is rust, it lived in Irvine (beside the sea) and areas like that so that didnt help and the fact its a 1988 car.

Buy one they are well worth it, stable, safe, comfy and fast.

The CD and CS designate sallon and hatch, the Carlson is the sporty versiont he Griffin is the all out super comfy and quick version.

If theres anything specific you want to knwo then I will try and answer.