Restaurant Photography

[Ian]

Today I'm going to an Indian Restaurant in Horwich to take some shots for their website. Looking forward to it, but I'm also very nervous - it's dark inside and I wish I had a camera with better noise control!

There's no pressure as such, as it's a favour for my a guy my dad works with and I can go back as many times as I need to before the 2nd September; but if it goes well he wants me to do the same for a dentist's practice.

If anyone has any tips I'll try and take them on board within the next few hours. (I have the 18-55mm, 50mm and 70-200mm as well as a full size tripod.)

If I'm allowed I'll try and stick a few photos up over the next few days, probably outtakes though!

Ian

 

[dunganick]

Teshi is your man on this. He does this sort of photography regually.

As best as i can tell alot of it is playing with reflections and DOF, maybe hiring a cheap low f stop prime for the day (if you got paid) would be worth it.

 

[Mesa]

Set white balance, use a tripod (not a high ISO) and play with the DOF.

Rest is up to composition - check flickr etc for ideas.

 

[Revels]

Have a look here dude..

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=418945

 

[Ian]

Thanks for all the input, had a look at Teshi's work and it's top notch.

I asked the guy if he wanted photos with the restaurant full or empty, he said empty.. makes it harder! He does want them to be quite abstract though, so I'll try and mix them up a bit.

Good shout on renting a lens too Nick, was thinking of either the 16-35 or 24-70mm, but might go for a prime possibly.

 

[Feirny]

Good luck with it dude. As said a decent prime might be worth hiring.

 

[Teshi]

Teshi is your man on this. He does this sort of photography regually.

As best as i can tell alot of it is playing with reflections and DOF, maybe hiring a cheap low f stop prime for the day (if you got paid) would be worth it.

I pretty much love primes especially if your subjects are not moving. The main reason why I opt for ISO800 onwards is to expose for ambient. You want the feeling of a place aswell as a dish/drink or person.

Set white balance, use a tripod (not a high ISO) and play with the DOF.

Rest is up to composition - check flickr etc for ideas.

To be honest, setting the WB is pointless if shooting RAW. RAW wont take into account what WB you set since it doesn't process your photo in any way. Everytime I have worked in a low light bar, I never bother changing the WB. Edit that in processing later. I would only work with a customer WB if shooting in JPEG.

Thanks for all the input, had a look at Teshi's work and it's top notch.

I asked the guy if he wanted photos with the restaurant full or empty, he said empty.. makes it harder! He does want them to be quite abstract though, so I'll try and mix them up a bit.

Good shout on renting a lens too Nick, was thinking of either the 16-35 or 24-70mm, but might go for a prime possibly.

Have a look at some of my work. If you have a step ladder, take one along. Ideally I would go for a prime since if its empty, you shouldnt need to worry about things moving about which you cannot move around to compensate. That will help keep your ISO down.

Main thing, bounce your flash.

There are 1001 ways to do this, its about finding what works for you.

Hope that helps.

 

[Ian]

Right well mixed blessings really, they couldn't have me today, so I'm heading over there tomorrow now. Was planning to go to Oulton Park again tomorrow, but that will have to wait now. On the upside it gives me a bit of time to read up on using flash, cos I haven't a scooby when it comes to that, matching flash to ambient etc.

Is it possible to bounce a built-in flash Teshi? I've got visions of a tin foil apple pie case selotaped to my camera, but other than that I'm stumped.

Wish I'd read up more on this over the past few months, as I don't really want to rely on a technique I've never practised before! If there are any particularly helpful guides floating around I'd appreciate it if anyone would point them out for me.

 

[Feirny]

I'm currently learning how to use my 430 EX and it's a bugger, so hard :dapprove:

 

[Teshi]

Right, let me try and break it down.

Your ambient does not have to match your flash. If you notice, you fire your flash, it instantly kills any ambient light. Its easier to manage with an external flash because you have more control.

I run a Canon setup so ETTL (auto) works well. Just need to be careful of whites since ETTL measures how much light is fired. That can be stopped by using a different flash mode. Leaving it on auto allows it to ignore how much ambient is in the background and exposes my subject correctly.

Here is a good example. Excuse the quality since Facebook is poo at compression.

Shot wide open/high ISO. I think this was when I got my 85mm 1.8.

This was not NR'ed at all but hard to tell either way. Shooting a higher ISO allowed more background light to expose. This was down to the camera, not the flash. The area the flash covered was the cake and table at max.

Ideally what you want to do is take a photo and have the appearance that no flashes were used. That is the key. The issue in this case is, pop up flashes do not have the same fine control as you do with an external Speedlite.

If you got some spare cash, goto Jessops, buy your own camera brand's flash, use it and take it back. I usually dont condone that behaviour but sometimes nature calls.

Since you wont be out tonight, try your tin foil method out. See if you can bounce with it properly and get enough light. Remember, bouncing a flash means that light has to travel further and disperses more so you might have to raise your ISO either way to compensate.

Run some tests now, see how you get on. Grab me on msn, mitesh (at) clarity-rebirth.co.uk

Ill be happy to speak to you on there if you need a hand.

 

[LaurenF]

Wow! Amazing cake photo!

 

[Teshi]

Thanks, if you get bored, there is a mini video I put together from a friends wedding. Nothing official but helped my portfolio.

http://clarity-rebirth.co.uk/dr/

 

[Ian]

Cheers for the run through Mitesh, I'll add you on MSN in a minute.. just working through a few quick tests.

 

[Ian]

I know what you mean Greg, flash is a whole other world for me atm!

Gonna hopefully have a quick chat with Teshi, but as a really quick comparison..

Test #1!

All photos taken in dimmed light, handheld using 18-55mm at 55mm, Av priority, ISO 1600, f5.6, 1/4sec (1/2 for no flash).

Bare flash:

Flash with hand cupped about 10cm in front:

No flash:

Going to set up a more controlled test in a few minutes.

 

[Teshi]

Try not to cup the flash since its as good as not using it. Try a thin bit of card at 45 degreed so half goes up and the rest should glow through.

Its hard to get right or explain.

 

[Ian]

Try not to cup the flash since its as good as not using it. Try a thin bit of card at 45 degreed so half goes up and the rest should glow through.

Its hard to get right or explain.

No problems dude, I appreciate you trying! I'll give it a go with the card. When I say cupped my hand I was basically imitating what you've described there with my fingers held at an angle. It does seem to have introduced more light to the surfaces without being harsh, but it's obviously harder to hold the camera, especially at 1/4sec lol.

Like I say, I've got til the 2nd of September to keep going back if necessary, although I don't want to overstay my welcome.

I'm tempted to get a flash, as I can pick up a new 580Ex II for £275 or a 430EX II for £175, which wouldn't be too bad. Not sure it would arrive in time though.

 

[Feirny]

No problems dude, I appreciate you trying! I'll give it a go with the card. When I say cupped my hand I was basically imitating what you've described there with my fingers held at an angle. It does seem to have introduced more light to the surfaces without being harsh, but it's obviously harder to hold the camera, especially at 1/4sec lol.

Like I say, I've got til the 2nd of September to keep going back if necessary, although I don't want to overstay my welcome.

I'm tempted to get a flash, as I can pick up a new 580Ex II for £275 or a 430EX II for £175, which wouldn't be too bad. Not sure it would arrive in time though.

You could have my 430EX for that price posted, with a shoe cord, stofen, side bracket.

 

[Ian]

You could have my 430EX for that price posted, with a shoe cord, stofen, side bracket.

Lol don't tempt me! All I'm getting out of this one is a free meal for me and my family (I don't even like Indian food ). Hopefully will lead to more though. I'll sleep on it and get back to you, need to read up on them when I get chance.

 

[Feirny]

No worries mate, It can be posted 24hour special for when you need it if you decide on it.

 

[Ribena]

I almost bought a SB900 flashgun the other day for a wedding I attended today (with hindsight, wish I bloody bought it now!!)

I hate the look that popups give, way too direct - hotspots etc. so I started looking for alternatives. Decided on a popup diffuser for the time being eg. http://www.bbjimports.com/product_detail.asp?id=99 unfortunately for me, this didn't arrive in time for today lol. doh!

I pick it up tomorrow so will do some test shots for you but it should help you achieve the "flash without the appearance of using flash" effect you're looking for. I'll keep you posted...

 

[Moz168]

Ian- If you need to borrow a decent heavy tripod Im only in Bromley Cross. And Ive got a couple of flashes and bits that arent being used very much atm if you need to borrow anything.

 

[Ian]

Cheers for the offer Moz, might take you up on the flashes at some point - will let you know over the next day or two if that's alright? Do you use Canon?

I do have a Manfrotto 055CL tripod, it turned out to be the piece of kit which provided me with the most inspiration today tbh - things look very different from high up! (Cheers for the stepladder tip Teshi.. didn't take any, but had the tripod way up instead).

Only took around 30 pics today, as I was helping out with the beer delivery lol. First time inside though and it's a classy place, well presented. It's a bit of an awkward layout but could have been a lot worse. Going back probably on Friday to try out a few ideas, re-work some others and generally take a whole heap of photos. Need the weather to improve as well so I can get some outside shots.

As for flash, didn't actually use it unfortunately - felt that I should probably keep with what I know for now. There were quite a few different light sources which looked quite good as they were, slatted blinds, spotlights etc. If I'm more confident with it I might try it out when I go back though.

Will put a few photos up somewhere tomorrow hopefully. I hate being this cautious, but don't want to upset anyone. :dapprove:

Some more quite good news, been asked to take photos at a tennis tournament on the 5th September, so something else to keep me busy.

 

[Teshi]

Good to hear Ian, I wont be on msn but if you want to PM me with a few, I dont mind given them a look over.

 

[Ian]

If anyone is around would they mind giving a bit of feedback on these photos please?:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ianflaherty/sets/72157622093947705/

Available to Flickr friends only I'm afraid (should be anyone I've added from CS) and I'll be taking them off in the morning. Only a few samples but I'd appreciate hearing your thoughts!

Edit: Link seems to be truncating for some reason, they can be found on my Flickr stream hopefully.

 

[Feirny]

I'm impressed mate, think you have done really well there.

My only criticism, some may agree/disagree but the food shots have been cropped too much IMO, I feel they should show the whole plate/bowl.

 

[Ian]

Just what I wanted to hear dude, I wasn't sure! I do have the whole shots uncropped, so might have a mess with them. I'm not too keen on the presentation of some of the food, but I had a look around and tried to emulate the style of some of the Teppanyaki photos (here), which is why they are as cropped as they are.

Edit: Are they ok in terms of exposure? Always struggled to match what I can see with what other monitors show. :S

 

[Feirny]

Ahh I see now, appreciate it more too. I think the presentation works well, just may be better suited to a wider crop.

My favourite is the pan one though.

 

[Ian]

Yeah no worries, I'll try a wider crop in the morning, cheers bud. It was a weird experience, good job I went back today as didn't get much the other two days! Still struggling a bit with the photos showing the facilities.

 

[adele_90]

They look great!

 

[dk]

I'm impressed mate, think you have done really well there.

My only criticism, some may agree/disagree but the food shots have been cropped too much IMO, I feel they should show the whole plate/bowl.

i was going to say the exact same thing!

too cropped imo, impressive nonetheless

 

[Ribena]

really nice photos Ian! Impressed with what you have done there, would like to see more shots of the actual restaurant though.

 

[LaurenF]

Ian, those are some amazing photos! As has already been said, the plate shots need to be less cropped. I absolutely love the pan shot, amazing!

 

[Paul_G]

Cracking shots Ian - just seen them on Flickr.

 

[Ian]

Thanks for the comments everyone, hope they go down as well with them lol. The flaming pan shot was sooo set up, the chef justed wanted a photo of himself I think. Does look impressive though with the flames that high.

Just noticed the cutlery isn't straight in one of the shots, d'oh. In terms of uncropping the food shots, how far out would you like to see? The plate in its entirety, or clipping the edges of the plate?

Nick, I'll try and get some general restaurant shots up later, not got the internet on my laptop at the moment though as I'm at work. Not too happy with them though. One thing I have learnt is that the 50mm and the 70-200mm are in a different league to the 18-55mm.

 

[LaurenF]

Ian, with the uncropping/cropping of the food shots, how about you do a couple of examples with different amounts of cropping to see what looks best? Could post them on your flickr for C&C.

 

[BenWall]

Fantastic work there Ian, you should be pretty proud of those. Bit of flash would have really set them off though. Keep it up though.

Love the wood testure and the menus by the way.

 

[Ian]

Good idea Lauren, will try it out as soon as I can, trying to get a website finished first so I've got somewhere decent to host them. I've put one uncropped version up on Flickr in the meantime.

Cheers Ben. Yeah I agree, would have been nice - some of the full room shots look a bit bland especially. With the closeup shots (Chefs cooking, glasses on the windowledge etc) I tried to make use of the available light, which I quite like. Just need to get paid for future work so I can afford the flashes and triggers etc!

I showed them a slideshow of 25 of them today, seemed to go down well, which is a huge relief! Also, I'm compiling a full set today and tomorrow for them to have; don't really know the procedure, but I think I'll just stick a copyright message in the EXIF data and leave it at that.

Found out that Lightroom can export slideshows so will try and get one up somewhere for the weekend if anyone fancies a flick through.

 

[Gaz.]

Great shots Ian. On my mac the table shot looks very dark, that's about the only thing wrong though!

 

[Ian]

Cheers Gaz. See this is why I think it's stupid that there isn't some sort of industry standard for monitors. I know for the average user they won't be fussed if things are a bit off, but my laptop monitor, PC monitor and the monitor at work show completely different things! /Calibration rant lol.

The table shot is SOOC, with a clarity boost and sharpening on export, s'all. The table lit by the spotlight looks ok to me, but I might lighten it a bit if it's looking dark.

 

[Gaz.]

This screen is probably miles off. Could partially explain why my flickr is so quiet lol.