No brakes when ignition turned on, just bled the brakes pedal pump method

[daelo]

Hello,

Just been bleeding the brakes.. a few mistakes to start with (was using the 2 man pumping method whilst maintaining the tube off the bleed nipple under fresh brake fluid to stop and air being drawn up into the system)

Didnt open the reservoir cap when i started bleeding the brakes and also started on the passenger side front wheel... after a few bleeds all was going well and checked the fluid wasnt empty so didnt suck any air in i dont think... then after a few more the pedal started to go softer and softer and wouldnt firm up when pumping... it would sort of hit a plate then if you pump again it would hit the plate again.

When the bleed nipple was opened slightly to let fluid out the brake pedal would continue to the lowest point and then I would close the nipple whilst the peddle was kept down. Like i said the peddle wont go firm but hits a "plate" and when the ignition is turned on there is absolutely no resistance in the pedal what so ever like there is alot of air in the system.

Im quite sure I haven't intentially let air into the system but it would seem that this has happened, is the best course of action to have the pedal pumped and only open the bleed screw to allow air to bubble out...but no fluid in the correct sequence? (rear left, rear right, front left , front right)

I hope i havent royally buggered up but feel as I might have!

 

[bmh.01]

Theres a lot of air in the system by the sounds of it, hope to god you haven't got it in the abs pump or the fun really will begin. All you can do it rebleed until you get all the air out.

Where abouts are you?

 

[daelo]

An update.. (btw I live in east sussex near crowborough)

It would seem there is air in the front passenger and driver side rear system as the other two diagonal wheels lock up when braking is applied.. ive been told most modern cars have two braking systems incase one fails...

I don't think bleeding will get the air out with the manual method of pump and bleed, how do the systems rate that use a tyre to pressurize the system and force the fluid through? Or is it best to get to a garage and have them bleed the system properly?

I think what the issue was is that my bleed pipe isnt quite the right size meaning that on one of the pump up strokes some air has gotten into the system due to a leak around the nipple area :rasp:

Does this sound about right?

 

[MicKPM]

An update.. (btw I live in east sussex near crowborough)

It would seem there is air in the front passenger and driver side rear system as the other two diagonal wheels lock up when braking is applied.. ive been told most modern cars have two braking systems incase one fails...

I don't think bleeding will get the air out with the manual method of pump and bleed, how do the systems rate that use a tyre to pressurize the system and force the fluid through? Or is it best to get to a garage and have them bleed the system properly?

I think what the issue was is that my bleed pipe isnt quite the right size meaning that on one of the pump up strokes some air has gotten into the system due to a leak around the nipple area :rasp:

Does this sound about right?

Most master cylinders have two circuits but this isn't new and cars have had this for a very long time. Hopefully it is just air and you've not flipped the seal on one circuit and killed the MC (You said above it locks up on Front/Rear oppersite diagonals which is how the circuits are piped to allow braking to remain balanced in the event one circuit fails). As above, try a pressure bleed method which should force it out but it can also be done electronically by actuating the ABS servo's if you have access to the kit which will be easier.

 

[daelo]

Bought a eezibleed earlier and 5L of brake fluid but to be honest I'm gonna drive it to my local trusted garage ... Fortunately I can take single track roads all the way there bar the last 100m on a main road the onto ind. Estate

Gonna watch how they do it to learn a thing or two and then return the brake fluid and eezibleed I reckon which are both unopened and unused so halfrauds shouldnt have n issue.. But if they do hell will break loose

Lesson of the day is don't hodge your own brake hose to connect to the nipple and let in air accidentally , buy the correct gauage 4mm hosing

Will let ya know how the garage bleed goes and if I make it in one peice.. Handbrake and engine braking it is :O lol

 

[spuzzcake]

Use the eezibleed you have - it is very simple and straight forward.

Fill it with brake fluid, screw it onto the brake fluid reservoir, connect it to a spare tyre with approx 10psi.

Then open your rear passenger bleed nipple with a bit of clear hose connected to it emptying into a clear jar. Whilst it is bleeding the fluid, pump the brake pedal 10-15 times, keep an eye on the fluid in your eezibleed bottle, then close the bleed nipple. Repeat this for the driver rear, passenger front and finally driver front.

If you catch your fluid in a clean jar you can reuse it.

Whilst fitting braided hoses at the weekend, I managed to let almost all of the fluid out. It took approx 30 litres of Super Blue to bleed the entire system properly using the above method. Without pumping the brake pedal I was not getting any air out at all.

I then took it out onto the road and got the ABS to kick in a few times and then returned home and bled again - no air at all came out.

Reading on here, apparently Renault claim that it needs to be connected to their computer to bleed it properly after air gets in the ABS. Another Renault myth busted, in my opinion!

 

[MicKPM]

It is easier to expell the air with diagnostics as you actuate the solenoids to be fully open, thus allowing fluid to properly flow thru the unit but it doesn't have to be done this way.

 

[daelo]

Was a breeze at the local garage, they had recently bought a new pressure bleeder and tested it out on my car.

Connected it all up and bled the rear right then front left... both of these lines had brake fluid coming out like foam! after a bit of bleeding on all four wheels jobs was a good un.. although one of them couldnt realise why the front wheels wernt moving and thought the brakes had seized up(without realising the pressure system was still connected forcing the pads closed :rasp

The pressure of the bleeding system was quite high (30-40psi) but it bled it in no time.. i was a little weary of them braking some seals but after a test drive and some lock ups (abs coming on) on the way home the brakes are working great with no leaks!