Which do I go for, 197 or 197 F1

[Marv-C]

Hi all
I am new to this forum but not new to hot hatches or forums. I am looking to buy a Clio 197 in the next few months (got to change the wife’s car first!!!!) and wanted your opinion on whether to go for a standard 197 or a 197 F1. Just before you all say go for an F1 (which I think are the nuts) here is a bit of background.
I am just the wrong side of 40 and although I am fit and healthy, I don’t intend to drive the car like I stole it all the time. The wife hated my Civic type R and will probably hate the Cup chassis although the kids will love it. All the reviews I have read say that the 197 has an amazing chassis even in standard form so will I be happy with a standard car.
I have a few questions, the first of which is the seats. The standard ones look very nice and I would appreciate your comparisons between those and the Recaros. Do the standard ones have lumber support and is the driving position too high? They look supportive enough in the pictures.
I have read a lot about ECU upgrades to cure a lumpy engine. Do all Renault garages do this as standard during a service and can it be done by a non-Renault dealer? If the car is out of warranty by the time I buy it (about £10k to spend so will probably get a 56 or 07 plate) how much will it cost to get the remap done?
Last one. How reliable has your 197 been? I am used to German or Jap cars and wouldn’t normally go for French (we all know about French reliability so don’t take this personally) but I fancy a change and I think that the 197 is a real step up in quality. I usually keep my cars for 4-5 years so don’t want to buy a whole in the ground that I through money at.

Many thanks

Marv

 

[ForceIndia]

For your needs, a late standard 197 would probably do. The standard seats are supportive and the driving position is good. Reliability wise they havent really hit the age when it should be a big issue, but stories of melting steering wheels are coming through.

 

[bob97531]

Sounds like a 197 Full Fat would do, just be carful with the earlier ones as the mpg is absolutley ridiculous....

I struggled to get more than 26mpg out of my R27 and that was mainly motorway driving too !!!

Good Luck though and welcome to the forum...

Cheers
Lee

 

[bob97531]

They changed the box apparantly after build week 48 I think which was around 57 plate....

I think....

 

[Marv-C]

For your needs, a late standard 197 would probably do. The standard seats are supportive and the driving position is good. Reliability wise they havent really hit the age when it should be a big issue, but stories of melting steering wheels are coming through.

Melting Steering wheels!!!! How is that happening?

I know that the earlier 197s have different 5th & 6th gear ratios from those after Oct 2007 and I only do about 5000 miles a year so I am not too worried about mpg. The hardest thing about spending £10k on a car is knowing that it will spend 90% of its time on the drive. I only use it for weekends as I take the train to work.

Thanks for your replies. I was set on an F1 but think that the standard 197 will be fine. There is a nice grey one for sale on this forum but I need to be sensible and sort the wife's car out first :dapprove:

 

[ForceIndia]

Melting Steering wheels!!!! How is that happening?

All french cows are plastic IIRC.

 

[Gally]

Melting Steering wheels!!!! How is that happening?

I know that the earlier 197s have different 5th & 6th gear ratios from those after Oct 2007 and I only do about 5000 miles a year so I am not too worried about mpg. The hardest thing about spending £10k on a car is knowing that it will spend 90% of its time on the drive. I only use it for weekends as I take the train to work.

Thanks for your replies. I was set on an F1 but think that the standard 197 will be fine. There is a nice grey one for sale on this forum but I need to be sensible and sort the wife's car out first :dapprove:

It's nimbus grey/silver and one of the best in the country iirc.

Seb is admin on here he owns it.

 

[ForceIndia]

Best Nimbus 197 owned by Seb in the country iirc.

 

[Gally]

Flol!

Ali/

 

[seb]

hi, give me a pm if you are interested.

from my well not very unbiased viewpoint I find the standard seats are very supportive and low enough for me. I am six foot tall and just under 13 stone so not a big unit by any imagination but not a skinny runt either.

I would say recaros are more favourable but the standard seats are actually fantastic things to sit in.

from memory the updated gearbox gives you an improvement of about 200rpm in 6th gear. so hardly massive.

but yeah give me a pm etc, I have had a fair bit of interest of the forum alone so i reckno i may have gone in a bit cheap.

My 197 is getting a good old scrub over the weekend and sorted out ready for when i hit pistonheads / autotrader next week with it. I may even pitch it a wee bit higher on there. not sure yet.

 

[Gaz_]

Indeed this must have new gearbox is a myth. They are the same stength, just a few 100 rpm difference in 5th and 6th. Thats it.

 

[Jamie]

BIG difference between R27 and 197s price for a start.

If I had the cash, go for the R.

Basic advise but that is what I would do.

 

[Pinkorstink]

Marv, being 40+ too is the reason I went standard, just don't think the decals work at my age. My seats are very comfortable with adjustable height and lumbar support. I managed to get mine (57/12k) for £10,500 withtax and tankfull so shop around. I would expect only the main dealer to offer the cure to the kangarooing but not 100% sure. In the three months I have had the car I haven't had so much as a peep out of it.

One thing to check is that it has a jack and foam kit as mine came with nothing. Spare wheel/tyre cost me £75.

 

[Rossy197]

I have a standard 197 and have driven a R27, Day to day driving i doubt you'd tell the difference with the cup chassis, Its 3mm lower IIRC and thats all i care to know about it, Some will say go for the R27 based on its got "CUP" Chassis etc but imo if your not tracking it the standard form 197 will be perfect, I also have the standard seats, I had the choice of Recaros but decided against them as they wear very badly on the bolsters from getting in and out and Renault will only change the seat(s) once through warranty, Some drive with seat covers over the Recaro but tbh that defeats the object.. My 197 is a 57 plate with 15k on it and hasnt let me down once, Good luck with whatever car you decide to buy

Oh and Welcome to CS !

 

[Gaz_]

7mm lower

Reason i didnt bother with a R27 or cup packed 197 was i knew i was getting coilovers, so a cup chassis was wasted on me. I have the Recaros, and have had the standard. The standard seats are lovely, lower than the Recaros (fact) and dare i say it more comfy on a long run. That said the Recaors have the wow factor (hense why i got them, badge wh0re see )

 

[Rossy197]

7mm IIRC pmsl <3

Also agree with e Coilovers, Will be ordering mine very soon plusa few lovely extras so watch this space

 

[Šįk]

Imo, if you are going to upgrade alot of stuff on it (suspension, brakes etc) go for a 197 as it's cheaper and you will defeat the point in getting a r27 as your just upgrading the bits that the r27 has over the 197 anyway..

If u plan to just to tiny mods (ecu or something) n just look after it n keep it more or less standard go or a R27..

Simples...

 

[bmit]

any thoughts on the R27 depreciating a bit slower?

 

[Gaz_]

Yep, they will for sure?

Re P4ers, what you mean about upgrading brakes? All 197s are the same

 

[Šįk]

Well wateva the r27 has over the 197.. I don't know but it must have a better chassis upgrades otherwise it would be pointless :S lol..

 

[Gaz_]

Stiffer/lower (7mm) springs, slightly bigger arb, anthricite alloys and Red Brembo's = cup chassis.

R27 debuted it, and came with Recaros as standard, and limited to a run of 500.

Anyway more feed back....

I've had my 197 for near 2 years now. Not had one issue i can think of. It gets driven hard once warm, and loves it. Engine is a peach, loves to be revved, and contry to what most 17 y/o oinks on here think, its NOT slow.The gearbox is also sweet, as too is the handling. Much better build than the Mk2 172/182 i've had before. They all run a bt lumpy wen cold. I Had the upgrade patch, but it didnt make that much difference. After a min or so it clears anyway so no biggie. They look good, have a nice presence, with out shouting about it.

 

[bmit]

its basically springs / dampers and some red paint on the calipers

 

[bmit]

beat me to it - forgot about the arbs

 

[TimR26]

Sounds like the standard 197 is all you'd need. Have you thought about the Megane 225 as it'd have bit more room for kids?

 

[Gaz_]

You'd be suprised, inside there is not too much difference. I know you can get 5 door 225's but they :dead:

 

[Marv-C]

Sounds like the standard 197 is all you'd need. Have you thought about the Megane 225 as it'd have bit more room for kids?

I have looked at a Megane 225 and have thought about getting another Type-R as I loved my last one (flame suit on) but my priorities have changed. The kids can get into the car themselves and I don't really care about top speed.

I want a small fun car that handles well and having done all my research and having driven many of the hot hatches over the years decided on a 197. The funny thing is I know I will like the 197 even though I have not yet driven one.

Also, a few years ago I drove a 182 when it came out (and also drove a civic type-r, a Leon Cupra R and a Mini Cooper S on the same day) and was hugely disapointed with the 182. One of the reasons was I had just come from turbo power, and the driving position drove me mad. As you may tell, I bought the civic and a year later had to sell it when extending the house.

I have done my pennance (by driving a Bora for the last few years - don't knock them, it is a fantastic car and I have a mint 2003 2.0 SE if anyone wants mine :approve and fun is back on the menu.

 

[Brett]

R27 imo. Pick of the 197 range imo.

 

[TimR26]

My mate had a Bora really good cars.

 

[Steve]

I want a small fun car that handles well and having done all my research and having driven many of the hot hatches over the years decided on a 197. The funny thing is I know I will like the 197 even though I have not yet driven one.

Ask for a test drive with someone from on here
Must remember when selling to drive slowly as when i sold the trophy one guy felt ill after a quick demo

 

[alanc1000]

Personally i prefer looks over practicality, so i'd go for the F1 even if the seats are dodgy, and even though i owned the standard 197.

In nimbus they look the business.

 

[Jasey]

I have looked at a Megane 225 and have thought about getting another Type-R as I loved my last one (flame suit on) but my priorities have changed. The kids can get into the car themselves and I don't really care about top speed.

I want a small fun car that handles well and having done all my research and having driven many of the hot hatches over the years decided on a 197. The funny thing is I know I will like the 197 even though I have not yet driven one.

Also, a few years ago I drove a 182 when it came out (and also drove a civic type-r, a Leon Cupra R and a Mini Cooper S on the same day) and was hugely disapointed with the 182. One of the reasons was I had just come from turbo power, and the driving position drove me mad. As you may tell, I bought the civic and a year later had to sell it when extending the house.

I have done my pennance (by driving a Bora for the last few years - don't knock them, it is a fantastic car and I have a mint 2003 2.0 SE if anyone wants mine :approve and fun is back on the menu.

Test drive a 200 - you'll buy one