Freak engine or dodgy dyno?

[Ian_s]

Had the 182 on the dyno with the east mids lads and got a bit of a suspect result:

Temp prob was placed behind the passenger headlight by the air filter. Is there anything with the dyno setup that could cause the result to be so high? The RPM syncing seems fine. The other cars got pretty much what they were expecting.

Mods are matched inlets, decat, Janspeed exhaust, RS tuner map and a cup racer style induction setup with a heat shield.

Its on 105k and gets thrashed everyday.

 

[Dan@SJM]

Tbh it seems a bit generous for a standard engine. Has it been cammed maybe? 170lb-ft from a stock engine is very optimistic tbh.

 

[Chrisgti6]

I think to rollers were spot on to be honest, you've only got to look at everyone elses results to see that. If they were all a bit high I could see it being the rollers, but I think you have freak of an engine. Most 1*2's were getting the 170+ usual figures. My Volvo has had 3 runs there this year and have been spot on everytime.

 

[Fred@BTM]

198bhp @ 6700rpm on a stock engine? No even possible on planet earth!

 

[Chrisgti6]

198bhp @ 6700rpm on a stock engine? No even possible on planet earth!

Must have been an issue on his run only then. 14 cars ran yesterday, Most got exactly what you would expect, some down on power from what owners were expecting. I think this is the only one that got more than expected.

Some graphs have been posted in here

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?744166-East-Midlands-Rolling-Road-Day-June-21st/page7

 

[ThomasBrentnall]

Maybe it's cammed! As already said rollers are reliable

 

[ThomasBrentnall]

Intake temperature looks hot, mine was only 30 something degrees

 

[Knuckles]

I was expecting to see 'supaflow' in the top corner.

ive always been under the impression that dyno dynamics were accurate.

but I'd be suspicious of that result, freak engines usually make 182bhp lol

 

[ALD]

198bhp @ 6700rpm on a stock engine? No even possible on planet earth!

Too right

 

[Matthew]

As others have said, could be cammed?

 

[MartinR]

Thats not a freak of an engine nor standard. Id also say cams.

Bring it along to our RRday in August. The rollers we use are pretty much spot but the ones you used yesterday seem very consistent in the figures.

Very intetesting though

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?748046-Midlands-RRday-Viezu-2nd-August

 

[The Russian.]

Mine was the only car down on power from yesterday and I'm looking into it.

 

[LiamR172]

Highly doubt it's actually running that sort of power with those mods. As knuckles says, freak engines usually make the 182 haha

 

[Nigel]

I think there are too many variables. My 172 made 196bhp twice on different rollers and all other cars made what they expected. Had similar specs to you, yozza, decat, matched inlet, rs tuning map, custom induction setup. I'm not saying the result was accurate but it was strange.

 

[B17BLG]

It's mapped and has that massive flat spot in the rev range? Did anybody see a flash of brake light?

 

[lesley]

Intake temp is way too high!
Wouldn't make that power with normal intake temp

 

[Chrisgti6]

I think it's the intake temp that's caused the increased figure. The figures in the table bottom right are the correction figures and are used by the dyno to calculate the power. An increased IT would give a higher than normal result I believe. eg my Intake Temp was only 24 degrees which was 2 degrees above ambient (believable with my intercooler).


I suspect the probe was in the wrong place or moved perhaps.

 

[Fred@BTM]

There's no such thing as "spot on" rollers, at the end of the day if its quick its quick, dyno's are for willy wanging!! If it can do a 1/4mile anywhere in the range of 13.9-14.4 then its quick!

 

[davo172]

Had the 182 on the dyno with the east mids lads and got a bit of a suspect result:

Temp prob was placed behind the passenger headlight by the air filter. Is there anything with the dyno setup that could cause the result to be so high? The RPM syncing seems fine. The other cars got pretty much what they were expecting.

Mods are matched inlets, decat, Janspeed exhaust, RS tuner map and a cup racer style induction setup with a heat shield.

Its on 105k and gets thrashed everyday.

MUST be cammed or dodgy reading for some reason Bring it to our RR day

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?748046-Midlands-RRday-Viezu-2nd-August

Put on on these rollers VERY consistant rollers would be VERY intresting to see what it reads on there rollers !

 

[Scrooge]

Mine was the only car down on power from yesterday and I'm looking into it.

What did it run at dude?

 

[The Russian.]

What did it run at dude?

235bhp somehow.

It's definitely doesn't seem almost stock

Going back up to Paul's in a few week to have a check over.

 

[Big Bob]

There's no such thing as "spot on" rollers, at the end of the day if its quick its quick, dyno's are for willy wanging!! If it can do a 1/4mile anywhere in the range of 13.9-14.4 then its quick!

Willy wanging PMSL best comment ever lol

 

[Fred@BTM]

MUST be cammed or dodgy reading for some reason Bring it to our RR day

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?748046-Midlands-RRday-Viezu-2nd-August

Put on on these rollers VERY consistant rollers would be VERY intresting to see what it reads on there rollers !

Very consistent in being wrong, clio v6's with their remaps making 270bhp? f**king no chance! Bullshit baffles brains I do believe!

 

[SharkyUK]

Maybe it's cammed! As already said rollers are reliable

Rollers might be 'reliable' but dodgy inputs can produce strange results (garbage in, garbage out). I think something is amiss here, even if the OP does have (hopefully) a strong engine (or indeed one that has some mod's he doesn't know about). The dyno is a tool that's only as useful as the operator and its consistency. It's quite possible that the majority of the runs were resulting in figures that were to be expected but one or two were erroneous. I've been a victim of this myself (when my car made around 178bhp on an unhealthy engine yet, on a more reputable setup, it made 157bhp a weekend later!) My mates 240bhp Type-R also made 360bhp on a local dyno... LOL!

 

[BoatNonce]

As previously mentioned 63 degree intake temp is probably to blame here.

 

[Dan@SJM]

Very consistent in being wrong, clio v6's with their remaps making 270bhp? f**king no chance! Bulls**t baffles brains I do believe!

I saw a company boasting on Facebook that their remap on a Vito van reduced a journey cost from £90 to £25. AFPMSL. That's effectively 29mpg up to 87mpg lol. Not the first time this particular person from the company has been found out of spewing bullshit out. Used to work for one of the traders on here

 

[The Russian.]

I'm going to put a pic of my graph up for you guys to look at.

Here's one of the IT&AT.

How does that look?

Mods are:
Manley con rods
Arp bolts
3in ktec exhaust
Forge recirc & actuator
Forge inter cooler
Itg panel filter.

 

[The Russian.]

 

[Chrisgti6]

IT and AT are fine, 9 degrees above atmospheric temp is fine. Mine were 22 & 24. You're engine light is on though isn't it? Do you know why that is?

They do appear to have run the rollers in N/A engine mode however. The roller rate is set lower than in was on my run. I believe it should have been in SHOOT_4F mode, rather than SHOOT_4 like yours reads. This means the roller rate was set at 100 not 150 like my run was.

Might be worth checking Kierens graph to see what it shows as a proper comparrison.

 

[The Russian.]

IT and AT are fine, 9 degrees above atmospheric temp is fine. Mine were 22 & 24. You're engine light is on though isn't it? Do you know why that is?

Yeah the helix clutch brings the light on over a set rpm due it the billet smf flywheel.

 

[MartinR]

Very consistent in being wrong, clio v6's with their remaps making 270bhp? f**king no chance! Bulls**t baffles brains I do believe!

His on about the rollers. We all know the maps are s**t lol. Yep rolling roads are b****cks as they are all different in readings. But the ones at viezu never seem to over exaggerate the figures when we have been, not like the one place that said my standard 182 wad 192.8bhp lol.As said though if its quick and feels good don't worry.

 

[Chrisgti6]

Yeah the helix clutch brings the light on over a set rpm due it the billet smf flywheel.

Does this not cause the ECU to back things off a little? Maybe something to do with the lower result? Seems weord for a clutch/flywheel to bring on EML light, which sensor is it tripping?

EDIT: I've just read about this on RST website, they say it's mapped out - maybe your map isn't quite right?

http://www.rstuning.co.uk/transmiss...-225r26-solid-lightweight-flywheel-p-270.html

 

[Gray]

Does this not cause the ECU to back things off a little? Maybe something to do with the lower result? Seems weord for a clutch/flywheel to bring on EML light, which sensor is it tripping?

EDIT: I've just read about this on RST website, they say it's mapped out - maybe your map isn't quite right?

http://www.rstuning.co.uk/transmiss...-225r26-solid-lightweight-flywheel-p-270.html

It doesn't affect power, I have the same flywheel fitted and my EML light (P0315 fault) always comes on when letting off the throttle in the higher RPM range.

It's down to the calibration of the TDC sensor I believe.. But I am not sure what the exact problem is.

 

[davo172]

Very consistent in being wrong, clio v6's with their remaps making 270bhp? f**king no chance! Bulls**t baffles brains I do believe!

Wasnt on about Viezu maps as said , was talking about the figures we see at rolling road days on a wide range of cars (not running there maps) , maybe they do over exagerate there figures for there remaps and IF they do they are not the only tuner who does this IMO , but from what I have seen very consistant non over exagerated figures on Viezu rollers .

 

[TheCAB]

From what I can gather looks like there is a business opportunity here.
Just email me your mods and I will forward at nominal cost a dyno output to reach whatever power level you want it to show. This would be in line with, and just as accurate, as what some dyno outputs appear to do anyway and I don't even need the car.

Saves money all round and you can still have the "bragging rights" !!!

 

[The Russian.]

From what I can gather looks like there is a business opportunity here.
Just email me your mods and I will forward at nominal cost a dyno output to reach whatever power level you want it to show. This would be in line with, and just as accurate, as what some dyno outputs appear to do anyway and I don't even need the car.

Saves money all round and you can still have the "bragging rights" !!!

Maybe it's not bragging rights people want? Maybe a piece of mind knowing the car is healthy?

 

[RSTuning]

That dyno graph is worthless with the correction been sky high because of the inlet probe.

 

[The Russian.]

That dyno graph is worthless with the correction been sky high because of the inlet probe.

Is that for my Megane Paul?

I'l be booking in with you in a few to check over and maybe tweak the map as I have some parts to fit.

If that's ok?

 

[Chrisgti6]

Is that for my Megane Paul?

I'l be booking in with you in a few to check over and maybe tweak the map as I have some parts to fit.

If that's ok?

I think he's referring to the OP's as his inlet temp is very high. The Dyno software uses this figure to correct the results. Basically it says car x has made 180bhp @ 50 degrees IT, however the AT is 22 degrees and will adjust the figure to allow for the difference between AT & IT (basically it'll increase the power figure as theoretically the car should produce more power with a lower inlet temp)

 

[RSTuning]

Is that for my Megane Paul?

I'l be booking in with you in a few to check over and maybe tweak the map as I have some parts to fit.

If that's ok?

No mate, the clio one. Didn't look at yours but there's something not right there!