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Category D cars - Your thoughts!



J.W

  RB 182 Cup
I've came across quite a few Cat D Clio 197's for sale, some at a great saving from the rest of the "Straight" cars for sale....

One in particular which is exceptionally cheap on a 57 reg, the current owner bought it repaired and has owned it 2.5 years.

Not something I've ever considered owning but at this price I'm starting to consider one if the repairs where carried out to a high standard!

Anyone experienced owning such a car? The one in particular had "passenger side panel damage"...
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
a 57 reg 197 was worth about 10k two and a half years ago. So that car probably had over £5000 worth of damage.... Don't believe all this s**t people tell you about ''light panel damage''. If it was light, it wouldn't have been written off.

I personally don't have a problem with buying Categorised cars, but they are a pain in the ass to sell. Bear that in mind.
 
  White clique
^ yes as above, i'd happily own a well repaired CAT D if it wasnt going to be such a pain to sell on - which it will be.
 

Jamie

ClioSport Club Member
Unless it was a car I wrote off and kept a hold of, I wouldn't buy one. You'll never be able sell it and get a shitty insurance value if you smash it yourself.

If you do buy one which has been in declared a write off, unless it's just paint damage you may buy a car which you can never fix and have constant gremlins. My friend had a Saxo which was crashed and even jigged and they couldn't get the chasis straight. It just kept popping drive shafts and he had to reshell it.

Personally, I wouldn't bother. If you're desperate for the car in question just buy one with megga mileage and fix whatever goes wrong would be a better option to me.
 
  Stripped yozza'd cup
I don't see the problem with it tbh. As long as you can see a record and receipts for the workthat was done, and it was done by someone reputable and professional I'd happily buy one.

As said though, you've gotta bare in mind that it's resale value will be sod all, so it's got to be cheap enough.
 

J.W

  RB 182 Cup
That's what I'm more concerned about to be honest, the underlying problems that can arise over time, scrubbing of tyres etc...

I've asked the guy if he has pre-repair pic's of that one Steve, it seems to be a nice car barrring the little bit of tidying up it requires, I'm due to view a straight one tomorrow at the dealers but I'm also tempted to have a look at a couple of these too!

Thanks guys!
 
Whatever you do, think with your head and not your heart.

Don't just dive in and buy a cat D because you have been wowed by it.
 
  recaro'd 172 rep
dosnt bother me at all. first ca was a cat d second a cat c and you would never tell. cheap to buy and ppl say hard to sell them on, buy them cheap sell them cheap. yes lots of ppl wont have 1 but lots will
 
  ITB'd MK1
Buy cheap, sell cheap. If you're keeping it for at least 3 years or so, then you'll be up on the deal, and it'll be of an age that it doesn't matter nearly as much when you come to sell
 

Gally

Formerly Mashed up egg in a cup
ClioSport Club Member
It won't affect the payout of another insurance claim by the way.
It's irrelevant that it's been written off before.

Cat D is roughly repairs that will cost 65% of the cars PAV just so you know. So your looking at more like £6000 worth of repairs although things like recovery and storage charges are sometimes taken into account. All worth considering.
 

Jamie

ClioSport Club Member
It does affect your future payouts, as it's in my insurance clauses. I think the payout is worded "substantially less".
 

Gally

Formerly Mashed up egg in a cup
ClioSport Club Member
Maybe on your policy but as per insurance terms, sadly is does not affect the payout.

I know this.
 

Jamie

ClioSport Club Member
So you're saying that if you buy a car which has been written off, and you subsequently crash this car, it will not affect your payout? So I could buy a Clio V6 cat D for say £7k, crash it, and claim it's worth 14k? And as you say, this should not affect the payout and I could get £14k giving me a potential £7k profit.

I've googled this as it interests me and it seems there are alot of threads on the net talking about this issue and it seems to be the concensous that written off cars all have payouts less than that of a car which has not been written off. From a common sense point of view, I can't see a previous write off not affecting the future payouts. Most of the figures on the net I've seen quote 60% of open market values for cars which have been written off .
 

J.W

  RB 182 Cup
I think I'll be leaving this one, it seems a bit of a minefield full of potential nightmares!

I have an 08 FF albi blue 197 to view tomorrow at the dealers with 28k on the clock, I've negotiated with the salesman and got it for £8250 with 6 months tax, I'm sure it's policy that it comes with the remainder of the manufacturers warranty or 1 year, whichever is greater...

I'll let you know how I get on :)

Cheers!
 
People seem to be using the words "written off" a bit too lightly, written off is when it is a cat b and needs to be broken/scrapped etc. cat d is where the cars damage is economical for repair and is in most cases un-recorded meaning you don't need a vic check, I have after working in a salvage yard bought numerous cat d cars which are un-recorded and repaired them as nobody is the wiser. Can be a minefield you just got to know what to ask and who to goto for your cars, look at receipts, documents from
The insurance company/salvage company and just make a wise decision obviously it is cat d for a reason, it's not going to be in a horrendous smash or it would of been a cat b and written off. just the price on some repairs will seem alot due to using genuine parts and expensive bodyshops who take people for mugs. Plus The insurance examiners that look at the Cars and make the decisions on what category a car is are very skilled, knowledgable people who work in the trade day in day out. That's just my 2P
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
If a cat D is unrecorded, why does it show up on a HPI then?
 
I never said all cat d's are unrecorded just some are and those are the ones you have to look for since they cause less grief, obviously not saying to go buy a cat d or c car and repair it instead of buying a straight car just some people like the idea of getting the same car cheaper if they don't mind the thought of it been in an accident.
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
If they're not recorded, they're not Cat D then are they. They're just damaged cars surely??
 
So you're saying that if you buy a car which has been written off, and you subsequently crash this car, it will not affect your payout? So I could buy a Clio V6 cat D for say £7k, crash it, and claim it's worth 14k? And as you say, this should not affect the payout and I could get £14k giving me a potential £7k profit.

Why do you think there is such a massive Market in buying unrecorded cars, repairing them and selling for a profit, the car salvage industry wouldn't be running if it wasn't for people doing this, yes I know People buy breakers but thats a small percentage of the whole sales/money that salvage companies earn plus you need a breakers license to buy cat b cars whole so not any idiot can buy it and try and sell it.

I know your on about an insurance pay out but im getting at why there are cat d and c cars around, Not an expert just worked in the industry for a few years so know the basics.
 
If they're not recorded, they're not Cat D then are they. They're just damaged cars surely??

I have only worked at a salvage yard so don't know everything but there was writing on the windscreens saying cat d and then next to it un-recorded which meant we already had the log book and didn't have to get it from the dvla but the car had been in an accident and was economical for repair.
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
I'm not trying to be awkward matey, i'm genuinely interested in this sort of thing.
 
If they're not recorded, they're not Cat D then are they. They're just damaged cars surely??

But if they had been through insurance, they'd of been made Cat D. I think that what he's getting at is not everybody goes through insurance, they'll just get rid of the car and cut their losses, or repair it themselves.
 
  renaultsport 197
I think I'll be leaving this one, it seems a bit of a minefield full of potential nightmares!

I have an 08 FF albi blue 197 to view tomorrow at the dealers with 28k on the clock, I've negotiated with the salesman and got it for £8250 with 6 months tax, I'm sure it's policy that it comes with the remainder of the manufacturers warranty or 1 year, whichever is greater...

I'll let you know how I get on :)

Cheers!

The car in question is mine , and yes there is still alot of stigma attached to insurance write offs

ive had mine 3 years no problems price reduced to £5495 now
 

J.W

  RB 182 Cup
Hi Dave, Your car looks to be a good buy however I'm just too unsure of whether I'd be happy with it long term not seeing the pre-damage pic's, best of luck with the sale though....

Well I did go to view the car I had reserved, not at all what I was expecting though...

It had 22k on the clock as opposed to 28k on the add.

I managed to find out it's been in the dealership for over 7 months, the brakes where even siezed on test driving.

The drivers seat had a collapsed boulster.

Rear bumper had been painted badly.

Misaligned front bumper.

A hatch was missing around the gearbox on the undertray.

Various seals where split.

The parrot was missing from the dash and had a mark where it had been.

Probably many other things however I was quite disheartened by this point!

This is the second 2008 197 I've viewed at franchised dealers in a week that has been shabby and not as described, my 182 Cup is in much better condition with 60K on the clock!

Looks like I'll be keeping it a little while longer!
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
Why don't you buy one privately then?? At least you'll know where its come from and how its been looked after.
 
  330i. E30 Touring.
Unrecorded FTFW.

I'd have no problems buying a Cat C/D if the repairs were of a good standard, and it was cheap enough. None whatsoever.

When you see how much some dealer parts are, it's no wonder cars are deemed uneconomical to repair!
 
  Ph1 ITB'd 172
Unless it was a car I wrote off and kept a hold of, I wouldn't buy one. You'll never be able sell it and get a shitty insurance value if you smash it yourself.

If you do buy one which has been in declared a write off, unless it's just paint damage you may buy a car which you can never fix and have constant gremlins. My friend had a Saxo which was crashed and even jigged and they couldn't get the chasis straight. It just kept popping drive shafts and he had to reshell it.

Personally, I wouldn't bother. If you're desperate for the car in question just buy one with megga mileage and fix whatever goes wrong would be a better option to me.

All good and well but many people crash cars and don't claim on their insurance so you have this same risk buying any car second hand! I'll remind you of the trophy lad.. that car could in theory have been put back on the road and had no record of ever being in a crash.

If they car is cheap .. 25% less that the average price of a straight one and repaired well I have no issues buying one (although I generally buy them damaged and repair them myself!)
Come resale time you shouldn't have too much trouble selling it really. I have sold probably 5 Cat C's and D's over the last 4 years and never found it any more difficult that other cars. Don't get me wrong it will put some of people off but you will get alot of people who just want a cheap car and don't care.

It does affect your future payouts, as it's in my insurance clauses. I think the payout is worded "substantially less".

Well on this one my sister has crashed a previously written off car and got FULL market value payout so I beg to differ.
 

Jamie

ClioSport Club Member
I don't think it's the same risk buying a car that isn't on a category register against one that is, that's a haphazard comment. You can say there is an element of risk, which there is (Of buying a car after being in a smash and no claim), but it isn't the same risk by a long shot. The difference between a crash and one which writes the car off is imo substantial. Ok, there is always "circumstances" where a small amount of damage can cause alot of damage - but that's not a risk I would be willing to take.

Yeah, my car could have been in a crash - and apart from doing the usual checks there isn't alot I could do about checking that when making the decision of a purchase. However, not everyone is going to have the ability to repair a car and not put it through the insurance. Any relativley expensive car, or car crash with substantial damage which warrants skill and labour will be beyond alot of people - as not many people will have the money or time to put into a repair. You may be in that position to repair a car, or not put it through the insurance after a crash, but I'd say the majority of people won't be in this position which will limit the amount of cars which go down that route.

I can't comment on selling on category c/d cars as I've never done it. However, I wouldn't ever buy a car previously written off unless, as said, it was my old car or a close friends and I had insider knowledge of it. I'm just too risk averse for that. Also as said, it's in my insurance clauses, that if the car has been in a smash and is a category c/d car, I'd recieve substantially less than the open market value which again puts me off.

Re your sisters payout, thats good for her, as above though - it's in my insurance clauses and seems common from Google searches on the net regarding reduced payouts. I find it very difficult to see how insurance companies would pay out full prices on cars listed on HPI's as crashed (By crashed I mean cat c/d as A/B have to be destroyed) when these cars would have cost less to buy and at an open market value, is less than cars not recorded. As ultimatley, the value your get paid out is based upon condition and market value. In addition, insurance co's are pretty tight and astute, so can't see them paying out more than they would need. I'd expect there to be some additional circumstances (In your sisters case) or that the insurance company didn't know about the previous crash on that car? Or maybe she crashed it only weeks after purchase which constitues market value. Otherwise I could go get a Ferrari cat C/D, pay a lot less, crash it, claim it was ok and be up £30/£40k ... Just doesn't stack up to me mate, you must be able to see this point, there is no logic in that. If the loop whole were that big there would have been many frauds going on over the years. Back to your sister, I'm happy she got more money for the car, as it's better for her, but from what I've read, that goes against the grain.
 
My previous car was hit side on by a female in a BMW 4x4. I've seen cars written off for less damage but since the value of my car was high and it was only a year and a bit old they actually repaired the vehicle!

Once it was fixed you couldn't tell unless you really looked for it, no one that came to see it could tell and it sold for the going rate.... needless to say...I got shot of it as I wasn't happy driving about in a car that has had that much work done to it!

Buying private is a gamble no matter what car it is.
 
  Ph1 ITB'd 172
Firstly I just wanted to clarify incase you felt I was, that I was not out for an argument or having ago at you in anyway. I was simply wanted to put my opinion forward as well as what I have seen happen first hand.

You do have some good points that I take on board and my sisters case may well have been out of the ordinary.

On the receiving substantially less point, I can understand why they would do this buy surely if you have paid substantially less for the car in the first place this is not an issue?

Another point I wanted to make was what would be more of a worry for me is the issue of the repair job quality. I would rather buy the car in its damaged state (as you stated though many people do not have the skills to do this) My reasoning for this is that I have seen many previously accident damaged cars that have been VERY poorly repaired, using older model parts, fixing it so airbag lights aren't on, etc.

You can get them inspected by companies and If you are shelling out £5000 on a car a £200 inspection shouldn't really be too expensive for you, this should give more piece of mind.
 
  F4R'd ITB'd '92 cup racer
It won't affect the payout of another insurance claim by the way.
It's irrelevant that it's been written off before.

Cat D is roughly repairs that will cost 65% of the cars PAV just so you know. So your looking at more like £6000 worth of repairs although things like recovery and storage charges are sometimes taken into account. All worth considering.

Maybe on your policy but as per insurance terms, sadly is does not affect the payout.

I know this.

i beg to differ ;)

come to us with a previously written off car, whether it has been repaired or not, and your value is gonna take a kickin' :D

for example, if 2 identical cars were sat side by side, but one was a previous cat D, you would expect it to be for sale for less than the one that has no recorded history. same rule applies when valueing for insurance payouts etc
 
Last edited:
  F4R'd ITB'd '92 cup racer
no but the seller is obliged to tell you it has previously been written off, if they don't and you buy it, the arguement is between the buyer and seller

we have this arguement lots at work lol
 
  F4R'd ITB'd '92 cup racer
i think the rules apply differently to private and trade sellers, a private seller can say they didn't know any history and plead ignorance, a trade seller has to ensure the vehicle is safe and 'fit for purpose' etc etc so they have to inform you if it is a previous total loss

field full of mines
 
  Ph1 ITB'd 172
i think the rules apply differently to private and trade sellers, a private seller can say they didn't know any history and plead ignorance, a trade seller has to ensure the vehicle is safe and 'fit for purpose' etc etc so they have to inform you if it is a previous total loss

field full of mines

Yeah the differences with private and trade sellers could be key to that.

On another random note; Swift cover won't cover a previously written off car... for me this is a bit silly, they will happily write off a car and say its Cat C/D and can go back on the road but then won't insure it?

Thats a diffferent debate though, thought I'd share it though as its probably important to ensure that the insurance company will still cover you if your thinking of buying a car that been written off in the past.
 
  Italian 3.2 V6
i'd own a cat c/d car.. but i wouldnt buy one as you dont know how well it was repaired etc. waayyy too dodgy.
 


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