279bhp from a non-turbo NA F4R? How?

[Chip-mk1]

Fred vs Chip - Clio vs Clio - NA vs Turbo! lol that would be quality to watch, I probably pay to see that!

Flol, im absolutely positive fred is a far better driver than me, im just an average trackday driver.

But Im sure if we tried my engine in speedys car round a track, that fred would be quicker in it than with his own engine, if he gave it a fair shot!

 

[SharkyUK]

Sharkey, dont get me wrong, im not saying dont tune them, im just saying expect worse results than if you tuned other engines, but if you have a clio and love it and it has an f4r in it, then you are stuck with it pretty much. So go for it.

Personally I still prefer FI, but dont get me wrong Ive built, mapped and enjoy driving N/A clios too.

Yeah, I appreciate fully what you are saying mate. For what it is I'm more than happy to be stuck with the F4R. The two important ingredients as far as I'm concerned; 1) like yourself, I really enjoy driving the Clio. An easy car to drive yet can be extremely rewarding as well and 2) I've gone to Fred for the high-comp NA build with realistic expectations. Either way, still looking forward very much to seeing your turbo'd Clio - I'd be telling porkies if I said I wasn't a little bit jealous. LOL!

^plus NA is faster

This is where I quietly declare myself 'out'...

 

[Chip-mk1]

You going for a diff too? What cams?

 

[MG cup]

Easily achievable power, the Sodemo 1600cc engine was pushing 240 with a single throttle body and towards 260 with ITB's...... ££'s though.

 

[SharkyUK]

You going for a diff too? What cams?

I haven't committed to having a (Quaiffe) diff dropped in yet mate. It might realistically have to wait until later in the year. Maybe. We shall see. LOL! AS for the cams, I've got Schrick 288's going in (at least I think that's what they are... I just dropped them off with Fred and left him to it).

 

[aucky]

Fred vs Chip - Clio vs Clio - NA vs Turbo! lol that would be quality to watch, I probably pay to see that!

When & Where?

I want to see the 100mph handbags fyling!

 

[aucky]

I haven't committed to having a (Quaiffe) diff dropped in yet mate. It might realistically have to wait until later in the year. Maybe. We shall see. LOL! AS for the cams, I've got Schrick 288's going in (at least I think that's what they are... I just dropped them off with Fred and left him to it).

PM JohnyE with the trophy RE DIff.

Dropping one in as we speak iirc.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Easily achievable power, the Sodemo 1600cc engine was pushing 240 with a single throttle body and towards 260 with ITB's...... ££'s though.

The headwork on the Ashford Motorsport f4r costs in the region of £2.5k for reference.............

Also the only thing that remains original f4r engine, is the block and head casting. That's it. Everything else is custom made to their spec, and Ilmor have had a hand in the development of it too.

It's a very trick bit of kit to say the least!!

 

[SharkyUK]

PM JohnyE with the trophy RE DIff.

Dropping one in as we speak iirc.

Cheers aucky

 

[Chip-mk1]

I can put you in contact with someone who does 20 % discount on new Quakers stuff if it helps.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Northloopcup, do you know what stroke it is?

 

[Kelv]

I can put you in contact with someone who does 20 % discount on new Quakers stuff if it helps.

Whats this then Chip?

 

[Jay Payne]

I can put you in contact with someone who does 20 % discount on new Quakers stuff if it helps.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Flol. Predictive text fail.
Kelv, quaiffe I meant (and gripper if you want even better on track but worse road manners).

And I mean Steve who you know anyway I would imagine mate? He does arrow and cosworth stuff cheap too.

 

[Kelv]

Gotcha, I half expected you to say Quaiffe but wasn't quite sure.
i do indeed know Steve, very knowledgsble and helpfull chap.
I'm pretty certain he helped me out with some bits for the mountune roller barrels I had on the escort.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Northloopcup, do you know what stroke it is?

I did do at one point in time, but I can't remember now tbh! Ah the joys of getting older.

 

[Fred@BTM]

why if Ilmor yada yada yada were involved with it is the cambelt tensioner still fitted wrong?

 

[Chip-mk1]

why if Ilmor yada yada yada were involved with it is the cambelt tensioner still fitted wrong?

Wrong as in non standard?

If its tensioning the belt properly its not wrong IMHO, its just modified to suit their purpose.

Like for example when running a very thicker head gasket to decompress the F4R I know that Mike from MWM alters the belt wrap so he can still us the same standard belt, but it doesnt cause any issues to do that.

So potentially if they are on a taller block, or a skimmed head, or a different thickness gasket, they be doing a similar thing.

 

[Fred@BTM]

look at it again, looks like its been tensioned wrong, i see it all the time! people think the hex is supposed to line up with the marks LOL

oh and chip, i do it this way

 

[Chip-mk1]

But if the tension is correct, its not wrong though mate IMHO.

 

[Fred@BTM]

well it is when the tensioner is boucing off its stops, which it will if its not perfectly centred on its markings! Check the ratio of movement between the front side markings and the rear stops, you'll be surprised

 

[Chip-mk1]

Maybe that actually want to limit its movement though?

Plenty of high revving engines out there that swap over to non auto tensioners, maybe thats specifically be done as a halfway house?

 

[Fred@BTM]

Been doing some research (thanks google) and it seems Tony Skelton runs a clio in Britcar production cup with ashford motorsport stickers up the side, if that car has that engine its not 280bhp judging by his laptimes!

 

[Chip-mk1]

They do various power options a lot lower than this as well Fred, its not their only engine spec they do.

Should think if you want to see good laptimes from an Ashford F4R the best place to look is the proton touring car which uses it IIRC?

 

[BoatNonce]

I think you two should get together and crack 300bhp NA.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I think you two should get together and crack 300bhp NA.

Sod that, would be a total money pit just to last 5 minutes.

 

[Fred@BTM]

na the Proton uses a Swindon Engine of some description i believe, Proton did use a Renault lump in their rally cars but i think that was a Sodemo effort

 

[The Fatty]

this the one?

 

[Fred@BTM]

aye, dunno what spec engine it has though

 

[Dan519]

Proton Rally car engine from about 4 years ago:

 

[Fred@BTM]

you play with it?

 

[Dan519]

nah, that was autosport '09 (?) had a good long chat with them though. Apparently they had loads of problems with valve heads dropping off. who knew?

 

[Fred@BTM]

bad batch obviously!

 

[Jay Payne]

Why did they use that engine then? Its not remotely from their 'family' of engines. If they could of stuck anything in there (rules) surely there would be something better out there

 

[Chip-mk1]

Why did they use that engine then? Its not remotely from their 'family' of engines. If they could of stuck anything in there (rules) surely there would be something better out there

The car had an f4p in it when sold on the road iirc

 

[Jay Payne]

The car had an f4p in it when sold on the road iirc

Did it? What car is it? A Satria Neo?

 

[Jay Payne]

Ah found it, that car never had an F4p but another model did, so it was from the 'family'

Due to an underpower issue, Proton launched a new waja version, the 1.8X. It used the Renault F4P engine, found in the Renault Laguna.

 

[rich83]

its a 197 engine from memory, 242 is the best i've done, but that's with the OE hydrsulic top end, any more than that requires + £4K

Bit of a thread bump this! But interested to know is that 242bhp from a 197 F4R830? What duration and lift cams were used to get 242 whilst retaining the hydraulic tappets, was it VVT delete and was it still on a single throttle body?

If it's an F4R730 it will certianly be on multi throttles, but I guess the cam profile is roughly transferable to the later engines?

Cheers

 

[DaveDreads]

Fred's doesn't come on much anymore mate.

 

[Dan]

Bit of a thread bump this! But interested to know is that 242bhp from a 197 F4R830? What duration and lift cams were used to get 242 whilst retaining the hydraulic tappets, was it VVT delete and was it still on a single throttle body?

If it's an F4R730 it will certianly be on multi throttles, but I guess the cam profile is roughly transferable to the later engines?

Cheers

One of our other traders Pure Motorsport have produced a reliable 250bhp F4R engine fitted in the hill climb car so they might be worth having a chat to if you are looking for answers