172/182 inlets

[broster@JAM-Sport]

Whats the going rate for an rs clio inlet manifold to be flowed on exchange, what kind of power does it free up, any proven gains? pics of manifold etc?

cheers

broster

 

[Fred@BTM]

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=205076&highlight=perfected+inlet

good read

 

[MRBILLYUK]

Its around £150 ish .

Both Stan* http://www.ap-developments.com/Services.html

and BenR http://www.angel-works.co.uk/ do them . Gains of up to 13 bhp have been reported .

 

[broster@JAM-Sport]

cool cheers for that

 

[FlameR]

wheres closest to northwest (preston) to get matched inlets. Most decent renaultsport tuners seem to be down south sounds like a worthwhile mod

 

[MRBILLYUK]

Stans down in Swansea and BenR's down in Cambridgeshire . You'll have to post your inlet . Any decent garage / tuners for Renaults seems to be Birmingham and beyond with the exception of Rstuning up in Leeds . Theres fcuk all round here

 

[TheJesus]

Its around £150 ish .

Both Stan* http://www.ap-developments.com/Services.html

and BenR http://www.angel-works.co.uk/ do them . Gains of up to 13 bhp have been reported .

pmsl, gains of 13bhp from that just makes me laugh. That was probably done on BenR's Lord of the Rings Lego Fantasy Adventure Rolling Road (tm). You'd be lucky to get that kind of gain from exhaust, decat, filter and remap. Worthwhile mod I suppose, but dont believe the hype

 

[Christopher]

laugh out loud.

 

[ja.jack]

Save your breath ,Jon, if the fools want to believe it, let them wallow in their naievety.

 

[broster@JAM-Sport]

whats a genuine power gain, more importantly can it be noticed?

 

[MRBILLYUK]

Save your breath ,Jon, if the fools want to believe it, let them wallow in their naievety ( sp ).

Hmmm . If i remember correctly you were naive enough to part with your hard earned :rasp: :clown:

Naïveté, a French loanword indicating the state of lacking experience, understanding or sophistication

 

[TheJesus]

Save your breath ,Jon, if the fools want to believe it, let them wallow in their naievety.

true Jim, I'd hope common sense would play a part, but people get drawn in by bulls**t artists.

ooh look, my 182 is now well over 200bhp with basic mods and inlets! :banghead:

whats a genuine power gain, more importantly can it be noticed?

3-4bhp I'd have thought, either way it will be barely noticable. Whoever says they notice a minimal bhp increase has been taking AWT Placebo Pills (tm)

Hmmm . If i remember correctly you were naive enough to part with your hard earned

Hence Jim is the voice of reason and talking from first hand experience, but at a couple hundred quid it's cheaper than an exhaust system and low risk. If it makes next to no difference it's only a couple hundred quid... but there's an old saying "you pay for what you get". Only time you will notice an increase in power on cheapo basic mods is taking a car from standard and putting on filter, decat, exhaust, remap etc etc all at once imo. If people are seeing 13bhp increased then the car was faulty and WELL down on power from the factory, but with all the different parts that make the car I cant see one part being as low as 13bhp, as what if the rest of the car is casted as badly? You could end up with 90bhp 172's... sorry, the logic of it just doesn't add up and people raving on about it left right and center does nothing to help the unsuspecting punter

 

[ja.jack]

If i remember correctly you were naieve enough to part with your hard earned

True, but even when I reported on the lack of gain from it, you all insisted it was my car's fault. The thing that hacked me off most was the six months he took to send it.

 

[Fred@BTM]

john the 13bhp gain was recorded on mass' rr

 

[MRBILLYUK]

Hence Jim is the voice of reason .....

Give over ! Is he paying you to say that , lol ? When has Ja.Jack ever been the voice of reason ??

He takes great pleasure in sl4gging off all and sundry . It seems to help his little world tick over .

Yes Jim , no Jim , three bags full Jim . How brown is your tongue Jesus ?

 

[TheJesus]

john the 13bhp gain was recorded on mass' rr

13bhp before or after graphs and results were manipulated? lol

come on Fred, in your honest opinion you really think a manifold could be 13bhp down? Trading standards would surely have a field day and this would also not be an isolated case, as there would be a load more like it!? Like I said in my other post, given that they are usually down on power for the 1*2 range then to have a 13bhp loss on one single component is extremely difficult to believe. If we're talking 700+ bhp Moslers being 13bhp down it might be acceptable... but on a Clio?

As I've said and known for a long time, BenR is full of s**t. Sorry to be blunt, I've caught him out too many times now.

 

[bradfincham]

would renault honestly spend milions developing an engine that had a engineering tolerance allowing a 13bhp loss.

I do a large part of my degree on quality control and I can tell you they would probably make batches of 1000 at a time. But the tool wear rate will be much less than thought. Maybe 0.25mm after 1000 parts.

Toyota tolerance is half that again.

Personally I can see there is an issue with the inlets not being the same, and i think the remodelling of them is needed. But i cant see it making such a gain im afraid.

If it does and someone can back this up with a decent RR before and after i will eat my left foot.

 

[broster@JAM-Sport]

i cna get the inlet matches at a very reasonable price so ill do a before and after run to see whats really there. i will do it next monday.

thats if people will acept our rolling road as being accurate tho lol

 

[bradfincham]

i cna get the inlet matches at a very reasonable price so ill do a before and after run to see whats really there. i will do it next monday.

thats if people will acept our rolling road as being accurate tho lol

on my past judgement no :rasp:

but i take it times have moved on at jampsort and yes id like to see

 

[TheJesus]

Hence Jim is the voice of reason .....

Give over ! Is he paying you to say that , lol ? When has Ja.Jack ever been the voice of reason ??

He takes great pleasure in sl4gging off all and sundry . It seems to help his little world tick over .

Yes Jim , no Jim , three bags full Jim . How brown is your tongue Jesus ?

let me guess, you're a BenR sack swinger who's probably never met him, but because someone you know spent a load of money with him and their car went down the 1/4 mile at 0.1 seconds faster on a colder day you are now convinced he's the second coming of Christ himself? Jim has spent money there and seen first hand, I've spend a load of money in the past only to be lied to and never have the work completed (I wont bore you with the details, there's a thread regarding it, but be warned, depending on how deep your love runs you may end up topping yourself).

People like Jim are refreshing in this place. Sure, he may come accross as abrupt and rude at times to people like yourself, who probably read at the level of a 4 year old, but it depends on what context you read his posts. It's certainly better than listening to a bunch of misinformed fuckwits who had a service there and based on this hail him as a tuning god and believe all the BS. I guess it all boils down to perspective. Ask 'all' the people that have taken their car to him, I'd guarantee 90% were fucked about and only 50% are actually happy with the work.

 

[broster@JAM-Sport]

i cna get the inlet matches at a very reasonable price so ill do a before and after run to see whats really there. i will do it next monday.

thats if people will acept our rolling road as being accurate tho lol

on my past judgement no :rasp:

but i take it times have moved on at jampsort and yes id like to see

humm.......

well either way itll be an accurate figure for before and after.

problem is there is always alot of rubbish about rolling road results, no matter what you get people always seem to think its too high or too low etc......

 

[Rob Clark]

hillpower does them also based in swadlincote derbyshire, inlet and pleham.

@TheJesus
I dont know you but seem to read lots of posts where you seem to be single handedly attacking anyone who has done something which you dont agree in, primaraly with a 'slight' GDI bias !

From my educated reading of this forum for 1year+ it seems
the inlet on an RS clio is poor and can benefit from work to it - yep. 13bhp perhaps not standard and a very poor example as 'may be' an inlet/plenum which is already in good shape which may show 1-2 bhp increase. At the end of the day you dont know till you try and its upto the owner to make that choice - its a gamble end of but i dont understand some of the ranting and shouting ?

 

[ja.jack]

Who's ranting and shouting? The inlet mod is a good idea to get done, does'nt cost alot and you never know what gain you'll get, even mine gained a little. lol

The Jesus went to Angelworks and got ficked about. He went to GDI and was happy with their work and service. Seems natural he should sing their praises.

 

[Fred@BTM]

john the 13bhp gain was recorded on mass' rr

13bhp before or after graphs and results were manipulated? lol

come on Fred, in your honest opinion you really think a manifold could be 13bhp down? Trading standards would surely have a field day and this would also not be an isolated case, as there would be a load more like it!? Like I said in my other post, given that they are usually down on power for the 1*2 range then to have a 13bhp loss on one single component is extremely difficult to believe. If we're talking 700+ bhp Moslers being 13bhp down it might be acceptable... but on a Clio?

As I've said and known for a long time, BenR is full of s**t. Sorry to be blunt, I've caught him out too many times now.

well considering mass' "print outs" are an excell spreadsheet they could be very easily manipulated yes, i know the owner wide (the bloke who owns that car that got 13bhp gain) and i've driven it on several occasions, its a quick one thats for sure, but i wouldn't call it memorably quick

 

[TheJesus]

@TheJesus
I dont know you but seem to read lots of posts where you seem to be single handedly attacking anyone who has done something which you dont agree in, primaraly with a 'slight' GDI bias !

not singlehandedly at all, it's just most people on forums tend to base their opinion on hype and what other people tell them. Having actually had first hand experience of AWT and through Mehdi when he had the white throttle bodied car built there I know a s**t load about how they operate. It's not a case of right or wrong, facts are just that, facts. Go into dealer feedback section and read my thread on it if you wish, you will notice a complete lack of reply from Mr Rushworth. Why? Because every damn thing I typed was true... oh, apart from I left out one other detail, that was he also kept my original Williams cams.

Basically if you apply common sense and look at the bigger picture, it would be plainly obvious that 13bhp from inlets is a load of pish. Could you imagine Renault's reaction if they read about some small time tuner on the internet that claimed one component resulted in a 13bhp loss from standard? I think their lawyers would be knocking his door down in a libel case tbh. I'm amazed no one else realises this really... actually I'm not at all, but I should be lol.

 

[Fred@BTM]

you'll also tell me that me witnessing a 13bhp gain from a viper with a remap is a load of rubbish??

again that was on roamers car prior to the TB's

 

[Tom]

Does ben himself claim an 13bhp increase for all applications of this product?

Roamers car doesn't count, that car was possesed by colin chapman or something.

 

[Fred@BTM]

upto depending on how bad the match was

 

[Tom]

Or "no"

 

[ja.jack]

Hopkins speaks with inconsistant forked tongue. Only last week he assured us the Maxogen would give no gains. Probably because I got one and was favourably impressed.

 

[TheJesus]

you'll also tell me that me witnessing a 13bhp gain from a viper with a remap is a load of rubbish??

again that was on roamers car prior to the TB's

was the car running in diagnostic mode before it was done? lol

13bhp from a Viper and remap is more likely than 13bhp from inlets alone that suggests a 172/182 would only be running 155-158bhp from the factory (going on the premise that a 172 is only 168-169bhp and 172ps). Either way, I'd doubt it still yeah, more likely that the RR operator made a mistake... like when Northy's Williams made 180bhp pretty much standard on a day when cars that were quicker on the road made substantially less... in the end they RR'd the other cars and low and behold they all went up in power (that was MiniSport RR day in case you doubt it, quite a few peeps off here went).

Come on Fred, you work with Clio's day in day out and must have been to a few RR days and had plays with cars of similar spec to know that's just unrealistic? The chance of the RR operator making a mistake has much more realistic odds than an airfilter actually making 13bhp difference after a remap.

 

[stan*]

Its around £150 ish .

Both Stan* http://www.ap-developments.com/Services.html

and BenR http://www.angel-works.co.uk/ do them . Gains of up to 13 bhp have been reported .

pmsl, gains of 13bhp from that just makes me laugh. That was probably done on BenR's Lord of the Rings Lego Fantasy Adventure Rolling Road (tm). You'd be lucky to get that kind of gain from exhaust, decat, filter and remap. Worthwhile mod I suppose, but dont believe the hype

That'll be the dyno yours was mapped on then?

Ive seen 12bhp on a friends 182...on a dyno which is painfully accurate.

I dont do bullshit, despite its deep colour, its often transparent.

 

[MarkM]

Just so people can read the original thread and make up there own minds.

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=99497

 

[stan*]

a gain of 10bhp was also measured on a 172, on the same dyno.

 

[Fred@BTM]

again no one actually knows how much bhp a car REALLY has to start with, you just have what the manufacture tells you, i'm on about before and after gains here (again)

i saw 13bhp with a viper and a remap, so did another fella chris (he saw 11 to be precise) same people mapped the car on the same rr

same people mapped the car on the same rr with the tb's fitted, car originally with 0 mods made 171bhp at fly, with bodies it made 212, i make that 41bhp gain from bodies

again car start with 171bhp at fly viper + remap it did 184bhp

Roamers still got the graphs


thats what i saw, and for 2 people to get similar results i doubt it was operator mistake

 

[broster@JAM-Sport]

for any gains to be taken seriously you need to do before and after runs, as you say it could be a good car or a bad car to start with, mine made 166bhp on our dyno standard, so thats my base figure for mods. granted runs on the same day are better and will be done with any mods i do to the car, i want to see if they work, not a fan of bolt on goodies that dont do anything.

its also not just about the peak pwoer in my eyes, this 13bhp gain was that the peak gain, or the biggest increase?

 

[Fred@BTM]

that was peak from memory, this was 5years ago! LOL

 

[Greeny.]

for any gains to be taken seriously you need to do before and after runs

 

[Fred@BTM]

Well guys (n gals) me and Fred are back from Power Engineering, and the results from the remapping are ..... Good

Now, before you all say anything, I completely forgot to ask him to get bhp @ the wheels values (Bugger) but there were no setup changes to the RR between runs so the results will be valid as a relative comparison.

1st Run - 173bhp, bit down on what both Dave and I thought it may be, but youve gotta have a starting point.

2nd Run - uploaded the first map, and came up with 178 - not bad I started to be happy at this point

Dave checked the fueling, and it was running leanish, so the mapping had to take this into account.....

3rd Run - Timing and fueling altered, and came out with 182.

4th Run - Timing and fueling changed again slightly, upd the rev limit and this time it came out with 184

Dave wanting to see if he could squeeze a little bit extra out and so did a minor timing change again, and re-ran, but came out again with 184, so thats what Im left with now, a RenaultSport Clio 184

The rev limit raise has left me with 98 at the top of 3rd and 120ish at the top of 4th, the increase on 3rd will be useful for the 1/4 mile.

Ive got the printouts of bhp and torque, Ill post these up when I get my scanner setup tomorrow (sometime).

The Bad :

Well, after stopping for a quick MaccyDs, we made our way back up the M40, going well, felt good, esp. at top end, then.... BANG got hit by a shovel head! which had been lying on the carriageway and got kicked up by a Merc in the outside lane, car still ran ok, so decided to pull in at the next services, I was thinking that it prob just hit the bumper and might have just split that - Oh how wrong I was It hit the bumper - split, grill - smashed, offside light cluster - smashed the lower mounting and internal plastic and the bonnet - kinked the bottom offside corner and about 5" up the side.... Bollox.

Gotta get a few quotes and see what the damage is going to be, but I know it aint gonna be cheap, Ive got some photos of the damage which Ill post up tomorrow when I get chance - Anyone know of an Iceburg 172 Mk2 at a scrappy with rear end damage??????

 

[Greeny.]

Fred, what mods was that with?