Intake manifold K4M

[Oliver_K4M]

In my opinion the long single hoses of the K4M´s intake manifold are optimized for goog volumetric efficency at low and medium revs but not for +6000. Also the F4R engine of the ClioRS uses a different intake manifold compared to the "civil" F4R versions. But how to shorten them by keeping the spends low? I thougt now about bonding some inter-connections between the hoses like drawed in the picture below and so creating a second plenum.

What do you think about this? Contra-productive? And what about the dimensioning of it?

Thanks for any statements.

 

[en035]

basic fluid mechanics says that you will reduce the speed of the flow and will create many different vorticity sites etc. So to me those sub channels wont work even will reduce your power. Try to increase the size and/or volume of the collection part of the inlet (renault 16v written part) hope it helps

 

[Englebert]

Dbilias do a Flowtec intake manifold for the K4M.

http://www.dbilas-dynamic.de

 

[Oliver_K4M]

Thanks for the link, it is still under development, but I will make an inquiry.

 

[mini-valver]

I'll let you know about what mine is having done when I get the car back and write a full report etc about it. Should be back in a weeks or so I hope!

 

[Oliver_K4M]

So that´s the DBilas intake manifold. I just got an answer on my e-mail from them with this picture:

Hmm.....pretty short and I think it won´t fit in my old Clio engine bay due to bigger hight...

 

[BenR]

that looks a bit gash

 

[Tom]

Uggh! but then to be fair all of their stuff does.

Very Very short.

 

[ja.jack]

Hope your one will look better than that Ben.

 

[leighk18]

Hope your one will look better than that Ben.

why must u always **** ben off just because his did not work how you wanted to dose not meen they are s**t does it?!

 

[Tom]

Woah! where did that come from? Fair comment id say mate.

 

[ja.jack]

I take no offence at leighk18's comment, as judging from his diction he is obviously a moron.

 

[BenR]

If i say that one is gash, would i actually go out and attempt to make something worse?

Mine will not be cast, so yes, it will look better.

 

[Dash]

Like who will ever be looking at it? it's under the bonnet.

 

[ja.jack]

OK Ben, dont be so touchy. If your new system is a winner I might even buy one lol.

 

[Oliver_K4M]

In my opinion too short for some low-speed torque left, I think even the trumpets of the Clio 1600 Kit car are longer....

 

[Dash]

^^^ Nice

 

[Fred@BTM]

and expensive!

 

[Oliver_K4M]

For that price (DBilas offered me €1350.- inkl. VAT and re-mapping) I can nearly get normal F4R-engine (140hp-version) with under 100.000km, and then I have both, power and torque....

Renaultsport parts are undiscussable.....

 

[Maxx]

What about just putting the car on t/b's with some bonnet mode to fit it??

 

[kd rs1]

What about just putting the car on t/b's with some bonnet mode to fit it??

Kein TUV? :rasp:

 

[mini-valver]

The Dbilas one doesnt actually look like it will do a great deal, throttle bodie has moved tp the side but the intake pipes are'nt a great deal shorter with it being at the side.
We'll see what happens with mine but I'm fairly confident it'll be better than that

 

[Oliver_K4M]

I think good for Group-F competition with big overlap and high comp. ratio but not for everyday use.
I also have something in mind....



By the way, the DBilas are still longer than these....

http://blog.kornemuz.com/?Sport/2006/01

 

[Oliver_K4M]

For the first step I optimized my OEM airbox so that it still looks stock-like...

(I wrote it in german, and it´s translated by bable fish)

http://world.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=de_en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.clio-forum.de%2Ftipps-detail.php%3Fid%3D537%26PHPSESSID%3Dfb3aec3bbf4dfad6aef54208038c2ba4

During winter I try to adopt an F4P/F4R manifold.

 

[Andyman]

Made a right c**k end of the fog light area mate

 

[Martin_172]

looks fine to me, thats a simmilar idea to what i done with my 1.2 16v airbox when i had it. except i ran the cold air feed to the standard location but used a slightly wider one.

 

[Oliver_K4M]

looks fine to me, thats a simmilar idea to what i done with my 1.2 16v airbox when i had it. except i ran the cold air feed to the standard location but used a slightly wider one.

Do you have any pictures of it? A friend of mine has also a 1.2 16V.

 

[clio__chris]

any news on ben's bits?

 

[mini-valver]

Nothing major. Got the magic part we were waiting for so it's a case of waiting now bud....

 

[Oliver_K4M]

Solution is now merging a K4M-manifold with a Laguna F4R-manifold...

+

=

But was a little work to do...

Not yet installed, but will be done soon including a dyno-run

 

[Mike_182]

That's shorter?

 

[Oliver_K4M]

No not shorter but about 20% wider, effectively they are now 3/4 inch longer. Don´t wanna go shorter, because that would be go hand in hand with torque-loss at low/mid revs.

I´m quite happe with my actual engine characteristic and hope not to change that much. Only better fillig at high revs due to lower flow-through resistance at high flow rates.

power-diagram

torque-diagram

 

[clio_manu]

Wow impressive job. I only have one question, what are you going to do with the oil breather that comes from the head of the engine to the intake manifold?, if this is longer how are you going to put the TB??, cheers.

 

[clio_manu]

I post the same thing twice sorry.

 

[Oliver_K4M]

There is this spacer-plate made aof aluminium that is inserted between the cylinder head and the lower manifold-section, so that the position of the oil breather hole and the throttle body remains the same. You can see it in two of the last pics.

 

[clio_manu]

Did you already did the dyno runs with the new intake manifold??. What are the gains??.

 

[Oliver_K4M]

No, because the car isn´t on the street, yet. I have saisonal registration that begins 1st of April, then I have to pass our Mot (TÜV main inspection) and afterwards I´ll go on the dyno...so this will happen mid to end of April.

 

[frediiii]

can't wait!

 

[Oliver_K4M]

Manifold is now installed. Car runs very well, I have the impression that the flat spot at 3000rpm is nearly gone and it revs more free up to 7000. Unfortunately I wasn´t on the dyno, yet as my reference-dyno doesn´t work at the moment.

Also got a brake-update:

- Callipers from the R18 turbo with 54mm dia, brakets Clio 16v, all rebuilt and red powder coated.

- Brake master cylinder from Laguna with 23,8mm dia

- discs Sandtler GT

- Pads EBC yellow stuff

 

[Oliver_K4M]

Was on the dyno now. Flat spot ist still present, but the figures themselves are O.K.

As always I had two runs that were nearly equal. It´s got now104kW at 5670rpm and 182,6Nm at 4690rpm. The chrakteristic didn´t change much, from it´s peak power it goes flat to the limiter. But the torque curve above 3500rpm is now more continous and all in all the torque level is higher.

But the torque curve above 3500rpm is now more continous and all in all the torque level is higher.