Light Steering/Poor Handling

[whatatash]

Just wondering if it is a common fault with 172's that the stearing be very light and hard to handle when going through the bottom end gears especially.

I know it might sound strange but it feels like the front end is lifting whilst accelerating. It seems like there is very little traction. Through 1st and 2nd it is really difficult to control and often have to let off because it's that bad.

Just wondering if a: you could shed any light on what may be the problem b: if you have seen this problem before, what kind of cash would i be looking at to fix and c: what parts etc is it that would be causing the fault?

BTW i have an 02 172 if that makes any difference!

 

[Turkish]

Any number of things can cause handling issues, most common are wrong tyre pressures or steering geometry out. If you are only having issues when accelerating hard in low gears its torque steer and all high powered FWD cars suffer it and you have to live with it. Other than that check tyre pressure and get the alignment set somewhere that has a proper 4wheel alignment ramp with laser targets for the wheels (not kwikfit monkeys).

 

[whatatash]

Thanks for that!

I constantly check the tyre pressures and are currently running 34 on the front and 32 on the rear. I think thats correct. However just after i check them the car does seem better for a week at least but still not what i would expect. They are also new tyres on the front so doubt it would be a tread issue.

I think i may need to get the alignment set. Any suggestions of commercial garages that have the correct equipment?

 

[Turkish]

you could try them a couple of pounds lower front and rear and see if there is any improvement. How many miles have the tyres covered ? sometimes it takes a few hundred for the level of grip to get to its best.

Depends where you are in the country, if you have any motorsports specialists locally with the equipment they will be the best to use as they have a better understanding than most tyre/alignment centre who just go off the book values.

 

[whatatash]

Might try that thanks!

The tyres are a few month old now and have done over a thousand miles easily.

I'm based in South Yorkshire and off the top of my head can't think of any Motorsports specialist centres. As you mentioned earlier the only places around are kwikfit and ATS garages!

 

[Turkish]

should be sufficiently scrubbed in then, could be alignment or just torquesteer if its only under hard acceleration in low gears. Im way down in the south so who is local to you i'd be guessing but i'd avoid ATS and Kwikfit personally. Might be worth putting a new thread up asking for recommendations for alignment near you, someone on here is bound to know.

 

[Lagerlout]

I'd try 32/30.... The garage had mine at 34/30 and the front felt very light....

 

[ben_p]

mmmmmmmmmmm strange with u having a mrk2 n all, the car is only a few kgs less than a 2ip 2 down should front end shouldnt lift

 

[whatatash]

Not quite understanding that Ben_p

 

[Munson]

I run mine at 34/32 and it does feel light(er) but I f**king love the feedback. My front Mich' PE2s are on the markers at 34psi and you can read the writing on manhole covers like braillle through the rim

PS. I think youre just expereincing torque steer, as Loony suggested.

 

[ben_p]

Not quite understanding that Ben_p

just a cheep shot at mrk2 wieght lol, splet 2 up 2 down wrong.............typo

 

[gh172]

Currently running 30/28 - bit low possibly, but very grippy. Anything above 31-32 on the front and my 172 decides which way to go by itself.

G

 

[Gaz_]

I run mine at 34/32 and it does feel light(er) but I f**king love the feedback. My front Mich' PE2s are on the markers at 34psi and you can read the writing on manhole covers like braillle through the rim

PS. I think youre just expereincing torque steer, as Loony suggested.

watch them puddles though, i had a nice aquaplaning moment this weeknd with trad like that!

 

[whatatash]

Getting a quote now for the Wheel Alignment using the laser targets. Any idea how much i should be looking at??

Also going to set the tyre pressures to 31F and 30R to see if this makes much difference.

Thanks for all the advice.

 

[Pete]

I've always run mine at 34/32 and had no problems.

 

[whatatash]

Before i bought the car the mechanics at the garage told me that they had done the tracking and the optiflex???? Apparently this was to completely setup the wheel alignment.

Not sure if they were talking sh*t or if this is correct. Anyway how long should i go before having the tracking etc done again. Had the car a year now!

 

[Pete]

What's the tyre wear like, that's normally the first indication that the trackings out. What about tyre balancing although with that I'd expect you to have problems at pace as well.

 

[Turkish]

If you've hit any kerb/big potholes you should have it checked out anyway. If the car drives ok and tyre wear is even there's no interval as such that it should be checked. Cost can vary, usually between £50 and £100 for a full 4 wheel geometry check and adjustment.

 

[Pete]

IIRC there's no adjustment on the rear so watch out if they try and charge for anything like that. Or camber adjustment on the front.

 

[whatatash]

Full problem:

Starts with lower gears and is very hard to control with slight pull to the left. Fine in dry. As soon as there's any frost or damp then then steering is very poor. If i'm overtaking, the car always seems to want to come back to the left and cornering in wet conditions can't be done otherwise the car would spin out. Need to slow down to at least 20 for roundabouts etc. Tyres are a couple of months old on the front and on the back are the ones that came with it, so well over a year old. Done 10000 miles since i've had it. Can't see any noticable deteriation on any tyre but theres definately not a lot of grip in poor conditions.

Even when on Motorway or high speed driving theres poor handling and again pulling slightly to the left. I Couldn't take hands off steering wheel at all!!! (Not that i tend to drive without holding on the steering wheel!)

 

[Pete]

What tyres have you put on the front?

 

[whatatash]

Not 100% Pete because they were supposed to be Kuhmo's but the place i got them from started stocking an alternative to them. Pretty sure its just a no-name tyre.

Thinking about changing the front's to 2 new one (Any Suggestions?) and then putting the 2 no-names on the back as they are still relatively new!

 

[Steve]

Getting a quote now for the Wheel Alignment using the laser targets. Any idea how much i should be looking at??

Also going to set the tyre pressures to 31F and 30R to see if this makes much difference.

Thanks for all the advice.

About £30 + VAT

 

[Steve]

Why do people buy a PERFORMANCE car, then put s**t tyres on them????????????

Save up your money & do yourself a favour & buy GOOD tyres.

It's the tyres that keep you out the DITCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you put teflon no mark tyres on your car don't ask why it don't handle grip etc........................

 

[whatatash]

Understand that pal but even "no-mark" tyres should still give you at least some grip!!!!!

 

[Pete]

Understand that pal but even "no-mark" tyres should still give you at least some grip!!!!!

Even the decent one struggle at times, put some decent rubber on there, will make a massive difference!

 

[Turkish]

You'd be surprised how much difference tyres make to grip level. Toyos for one are great in the dry but widowmakers in the wet. Also i'd check you have the correct speed rating fitted as this can invalidate your insurance on top of them having f*ck all grip.

 

[whatatash]

The tyres are 195/45/R16 with speed rating V.

 

[Pete]

They may bethe correct size and rating but that doesn't mean they are any good. Try Exaltos or go back to using conti's. What have you got running on the back?

 

[whatatash]

Continental's that came with it?

So what order should i look into sorting the car!

New tyres (Good makes???)
Correct tyre pressures
Wheel alignment, tracking etc

 

[Pete]

You could try swapping the front to the rear just to see if that removes the problem but if the tyres are that bad then be very careful.

 

[whatatash]

Will try that Pete but the rears haven't loads of tread but appreciate that they are a better tyre and could make a difference.

I think i will have to end up purchasing some new tyres. I've been reading through some other threads and found that most people rave about either Goodyear F1's or Michelin PE2's??

What tyre?? Also should i go for 2 or all 4 to get a full new setup!??

 

[Turkish]

Two should sort any issues but if the others arent far off then i'd change all four when the rears are shot and get some 205.45.16s put on, PE2s goodyears or contis will be better than some made in ukraine cheap plastic shite.

 

[whatatash]

lol Just been pricing up from PE2's from Mytyres and they are just short of £90.

Anywhere else i should be looking or is that a decnt price?

 

[Turkish]

Thats the going rate for PE2s im afraid. if you want to keep the cost down contis are about 45 a corner for 195s If you can stretch to it i'd go for 205s in goodyears or PE2s personally.

 

[whatatash]

Will it be a problem then if i only change the front to 205 with the back staying as 195's.

Any performance or handling issues???