Question: F4R-T(S)

[Jakey92]

I'm not in a financial position to do this, I'm just woundering:

Would a Megane head and internals work well on a normal Clio F4R bottom end but Supercharged?
I'm not sure on compression ratios etc and I always thought it would be cool to have a Megane cylinder head, cams, inlet, and internals with a 182 manifold and cat. The intercooler piping would suit the Clio engine bay as it is only a 90 degree bend from the Charger to the Intercooler then on the outlet, the pipes don't have to bend round the battery to get to the inlet as the Megane inlet would be facing the right way.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I see no reason why it wouldn't work fine.

 

[Jakey92]

I see no reason why it wouldn't work fine.

Ah good. If only I had the budget! I've seen many Supercharged Clios and seen one by Cupman with the F4R-T conversion (amongst many other turbos aswell, like yours) but I haven't seen any combined. Would love to see it happen

 

[Chip-mk1]

Ah good. If only I had the budget! I've seen many Supercharged Clios and seen one by Cupman with the F4R-T conversion (amongst many other turbos aswell, like yours) but I haven't seen any combined. Would love to see it happen

I dont think it would be some magical formula to a great engine TBH, personally I would sooner have the option of using the VVT on the clio head than to remove that.
But im sure it would fundamentally work, the CR is suitable for sure.

 

[Jakey92]

I dont think it would be some magical formula to a great engine TBH, personally I would sooner have the option of using the VVT on the clio head than to remove that.
But im sure it would fundamentally work, the CR is suitable for sure.

I thought about the VVT but it was my understanding that the 'kick' gets mapped out? I know it wouldn't be particularly amazing but due to space constraints and in the idea of creating something not done before, I'd like to see it happen. Plus one of the main ideas about using the Megane head was so the internals would work well with something it was built for (i.e Boost).

 

[Chip-mk1]

I thought about the VVT but it was my understanding that the 'kick' gets mapped out? I know it wouldn't be particularly amazing but due to space constraints and in the idea of creating something not done before, I'd like to see it happen. Plus one of the main ideas about using the Megane head was so the internals would work well with something it was built for (i.e Boost).

"Kick" has NOTHING to do with VVT operation

VVT operates at 1800rpm


A better term is "sub 5k torque hole" as its not like it does something amazing at 5k, its just that its rubbish up till then as a combination of a poor standard map and the poor standard inlet manifold.

 

[Jakey92]

"Kick" has NOTHING to do with VVT operation

VVT operates at 1800rpm


A better term is "sub 5k torque hole" as its not like it does something amazing at 5k, its just that its rubbish up till then as a combination of a poor standard map and the poor standard inlet manifold.

Ah right, I have been wrongly informed then. I was under the impression that the 'kick' was due to the variation in valve timing (I'm no mechanic, just looking for knowledge).

So would a Supercharged engine benefit from having the Clio cam setup?

 

[w33 brl]

theres no vvt in a 225 engine so dont need to worry about that, the problem you will have is getting the supercharger bracket to fit with the megane inlet,

as for the cams cupman had 172 cams in his megane head just you have to set the timing 8 degree's out (I think) so the valves dont hit the pistons

as for the pipework it maybe alot easier than the turbo as its a complete B**ch for me the now

 

[Jakey92]

theres no vvt in a 225 engine so dont need to worry about that, the problem you will have is getting the supercharger bracket to fit with the megane inlet,

I didn't think it would be an issue as I believe the bracket is quite low down?

as for the pipework it maybe alot easier than the turbo as its a complete B**ch for me the now

That was the majority part of why I came up with this idea. Seen a few turbo builds with problems at the back of the engine. Plus I'm a big fan of Supercharged Clios

 

[w33 brl]

depends on the bracket I suppose

personally i think its the megane inlet thats been given me the headache, but think ive got it now tho

 

[DannyR]

I always wanted to do it but there was no real gain.

Both engines were safe upto the same power really, the Megane engine isn't that much stronger. It allows you to run a little more boost, but it would then be able to run more power than would be reliable if that makes sense?

 

[Jakey92]

I always wanted to do it but there was no real gain.

Both engines were safe upto the same power really, the Megane engine isn't that much stronger. It allows you to run a little more boost, but it would then be able to run more power than would be reliable if that makes sense?

Yeah I get you. So if the car was on a safe map then the Megane extras would give you slightly more capability. And due to the above mentioned, you would be without having to worry about getting a noisey VVT pulley.

Imagine this on a Trophy

 

[Chip-mk1]

I'd just put forged pistons and rods in a clio engine, if you are pulling it apart anyway its not much difference in cost.

 

[Jakey92]

I'd just put forged pistons and rods in a clio engine, if you are pulling it apart anyway its not much difference in cost.

What are they like when used as a daily? I heard somewhere that they can be noisey when cold?

 

[Chip-mk1]

What are they like when used as a daily? I heard somewhere that they can be noisey when cold?

Actually, yes for a daily any forged piston is a lousy choice, sorry I was talking in the context of a trackday and weekend toy.

 

[Jakey92]

Actually, yes for a daily any forged piston is a lousy choice, sorry I was talking in the context of a trackday and weekend toy.

Alright nice one. A forged up Supercharged Clio would be one hell of a track monster! Much like your Turbo Clio

 

[Spinksy]

Actually, yes for a daily any forged piston is a lousy choice, sorry I was talking in the context of a trackday and weekend toy.

Chipipedia

EFA

Tbh I think you should have that as a signature after each of your posts lol

On the subjects of turbo/supercharger ... Would it be any more beneficial power/efficiency wise to supercharge a Dci on top of its current set up? (Or to replace the turbo for a supercharger?)

Sorry to steal the thread Jake but I am trying to decide for distant future projects on my Clio whether a mental Dci or a turbo'd F4R would be a better route...

 

[Chip-mk1]

EFA

Tbh I think you should have that as a signature after each of your posts lol

You seem to be jumping on last weeks very dull bangwagon very late, epic fail there IMHO

 

[Jakey92]

On the subjects of turbo/supercharger ... Would it be any more beneficial power/efficiency wise to supercharge a Dci on top of its current set up? (Or to replace the turbo for a supercharger?)

Sorry to steal the thread Jake but I am trying to decide for distant future projects on my Clio whether a mental Dci or a turbo'd F4R would be a better route...

As far as replacing the turbo for a supercharger, I wouldn't do it. Apparently you don't see many non-turbo diesels because the exhaust gases create too greater force to let it go to waste.

But I do like the idea of TSi DCi. Check out the Black Smoke Racing from BDC (British Drift Championships). They run an estate diesel Merc with a Supercharger and a Turbo (with NOS for white and black smoke)

 

[Spinksy]

As far as replacing the turbo for a supercharger, I wouldn't do it. Apparently you don't see many non-turbo diesels because the exhaust gases create too greater force to let it go to waste.

But I do like the idea of TSi DCi. Check out the Black Smoke Racing from BDC (British Drift Championships). They run an estate diesel Merc with a Supercharger and a Turbo (with NOS for white and black smoke)

Cool beans

Il check that out mate, I think a mental Dci sounds like a more fun route then

 

[Chip-mk1]

Cool beans

Il check that out mate, I think a mental Dci sounds like a more fun route then

Its a 1.5 litre 8 valve diesel engine with a not very well flowing head.
You will spend a lot of money just to get N/A F4R performance and are unlikely even with deep pockets to get anywhere even close to a half decent F4R turbo.

Your money though, do what you want...

 

[SC03OTT]

The money he was moaning about not having, just weeks ago.

 

[Spinksy]

Its a 1.5 litre 8 valve diesel engine with a not very well flowing head.
You will spend a lot of money just to get N/A F4R performance and are unlikely even with deep pockets to get anywhere even close to a half decent F4R turbo.

Your money though, do what you want...

Tbf chip I did ask for advice and I am open to receiving it which is why I asked....

The money he was moaning about not having, just weeks ago.

And I also said in the post this was for the distant future.... Like when I have a better paid/full time job