150bhp per ton - Detune 182

[GazzaCup]

Hi, sounds like an odd question.
Looking at the possibility of racing 750 club Hot Hatch.
Would like to compete in Class C, any car with 150bhp per ton.
Would like to detune my Clio (don't wan to buy an ST thing).
I would like to get car down to 1 ton, so would need 150bhp.
Is it possible ? Hope to achieve a reliable and lightweight car.
Also, predicting the question, class up is 200bhp per ton. A friend runs in this class, no way I have the budget.
Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

[JB21]

If you detune the f4r it just wouldn't be the same car, not even sure its possible anyway without some custom map. Just add weight as its free and see how it feels, probably best adding it to the rear of the front seats as well. If a 182 so 180hp you'd only need the car to weigh 1200kg which is 150hp/per tonne.

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

All you'd need is a remap, whether the regs would allow it is another question.

 

[imprezaworks]

Just get someone crap to do the belts

 

[GazzaCup]

If you detune the f4r it just wouldn't be the same car, not even sure its possible anyway without some custom map. Just add weight as its free and see how it feels, probably best adding it to the rear of the front seats as well. If a 182 so 180hp you'd only need the car to weigh 1200kg which is 150hp/per tonne.

Thanks, was hoping to keep it as light as possible. Thinking brakes and tyre life. Although I think playing around with weight distribution could be beneficial.

 

[GazzaCup]

All you'd need is a remap, whether the regs would allow it is another question.

Thanks. All good for regs, they weigh and rolling road the car on the day.

 

[adamlstr]

Just get someone crap to do the belts

Actually lol'd. Not done that on CS for a while, top drawer.


@OP, 200bhp/ton is 180bhp at 900kgs. I'd have thought that would be fairly attainable in a 182. Without spending a fortune, or is that class just a bunch of wallet racers?

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

They're all around 150bhp anyway iirc

 

[flebay]

Hi, sounds like an odd question.
Looking at the possibility of racing 750 club Hot Hatch.
Would like to compete in Class C, any car with 150bhp per ton.
Would like to detune my Clio (don't wan to buy an ST thing).
I would like to get car down to 1 ton, so would need 150bhp.
Is it possible ? Hope to achieve a reliable and lightweight car.
Also, predicting the question, class up is 200bhp per ton. A friend runs in this class, no way I have the budget.
Any advice would be much appreciated.

Easy fit one of these

 

[Martin_172]

a 140bhp Twingo GT would be bang on the money - at standard weight of 980kg - obviously more to be saved with stripping out and more to be added with a cage (I don't know all the ins and outs of the class)

Clio Chassis, 172/182 torque and your 150bhp per tonne target

 

[GazzaCup]

Actually lol'd. Not done that on CS for a while, top drawer.


@OP, 200bhp/ton is 180bhp at 900kgs. I'd have thought that would be fairly attainable in a 182. Without spending a fortune, or is that class just a bunch of wallet racers?

Some serious money spent in class b, and I on a seriously small budget. Never going to be ultra competitive but would be nice to say I have had a go.

 

[Steven_K]

Hi, sounds like an odd question.
Looking at the possibility of racing 750 club Hot Hatch.
Would like to compete in Class C, any car with 150bhp per ton.
Would like to detune my Clio (don't wan to buy an ST thing).
I would like to get car down to 1 ton, so would need 150bhp.
Is it possible ? Hope to achieve a reliable and lightweight car.
Also, predicting the question, class up is 200bhp per ton. A friend runs in this class, no way I have the budget.
Any advice would be much appreciated.

Silly question, what the weight and bhp currents of your 182 ??

I'm racing with the TDT and TDC and have done something similar in that I've come out of class B into C which is 150bhp per ton.

In MSVR it's BHP at the Hubs, in on a 172 with 162bhp on the hub, I'm racing a declared weight of 1080 inc driver. It's a stripped out car.

My point is... You might not have to do a lot ... I've added 20kgs on the passenger side that's all.


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[JB21]

Just looking at the trackday championship and they run clio 172 cups in class B which is 150hp/tonne and they're running 2:05 laps at Oulton so no chance they're detuned.

@Steven_K is this the same as you're on about above?

 

[Steven_K]

B class is 151 to 175bhp/ton



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[JB21]

Sorry yeah class C...
http://www.trackdaychampionship.com/teams/2016-teams/

Here's the HT racing 172 cup at Oulton, its a flyer for 150hp/tonne...[/QUOTE]

 

[GazzaCup]

Silly question, what the weight and bhp currents of your 182 ??

I'm racing with the TDT and TDC and have done something similar in that I've come out of class B into C which is 150bhp per ton.

In MSVR it's BHP at the Hubs, in on a 172 with 162bhp on the hub, I'm racing a declared weight of 1080 inc driver. It's a stripped out car.

My point is... You might not have to do a lot ... I've added 20kgs on the passenger side that's all.


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Sounds like I wont be far away with the 182. Very useful information on weights and Bhp thanks
Sounds like same regs, weight including driver and bhp at hubs.
Still building, aiming for car to be around 1000kg, I weigh around 80kg.
Would rather get it lighter and detune 10 -15 BP, seen what weight does to tyres and brakes. My mate runs a 205Gti, that comes in around 750kg.
But could I map the engine to still perform well ? Increase torque less top end?

 

[Steven_K]

It's not tyres chap ... It's brakes but the clio is so good I'm still on standard brakes with Ds3000 pads ... And you can go even more aggressive.

I came off a clio to a Mini Cooper S as I couldn't get my weight lower enough (I had an enormous roll cage setup) so opted for BHP with the mini, then in 2016 they changed power testers for the series and I got too much BHP ... The Dyno read 10% more and I ended up bottom of class B instead of top of class C. I've swapped back to the clio and pocketed the cash just to race in Class C. 1st race in Class C / Clio and I won the class at Brands [emoji106][emoji106][emoji469]

I'd say hot hatch is a brave class to go to ... But if you have a mate racing in it then it's an obvious choice to be honest.

In hot hatch you will need a diff I'm sure, it's not always about bhp/ton but as you say, do t have to have big budgets ... It's nice to say "yeah i did that!!" I'm without a diff at the mo, don't expect a class podium on sat in TDC but I'll give it a go [emoji106].

The tyres I swear by are the Dunlop Dz03g H1 ... 205/50/15 and they're £260 a pair ... They last good!! I've done the R1s last race and they did ok ... But the H1 just seem to take the heat cycle so much better ... I race for 45mins so there's the potential for quite a bit of heat if I over drive the car ... The diff in the mini really did help that!!




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[GazzaCup]

It's not tyres chap ... It's brakes but the clio is so good I'm still on standard brakes with Ds3000 pads ... And you can go even more aggressive.

I came off a clio to a Mini Cooper S as I couldn't get my weight lower enough (I had an enormous roll cage setup) so opted for BHP with the mini, then in 2016 they changed power testers for the series and I got too much BHP ... The Dyno read 10% more and I ended up bottom of class B instead of top of class C. I've swapped back to the clio and pocketed the cash just to race in Class C. 1st race in Class C / Clio and I won the class at Brands [emoji106][emoji106][emoji469]

I'd say hot hatch is a brave class to go to ... But if you have a mate racing in it then it's an obvious choice to be honest.

In hot hatch you will need a diff I'm sure, it's not always about bhp/ton but as you say, do t have to have big budgets ... It's nice to say "yeah i did that!!" I'm without a diff at the mo, don't expect a class podium on sat in TDC but I'll give it a go [emoji106].

The tyres I swear by are the Dunlop Dz03g H1 ... 205/50/15 and they're £260 a pair ... They last good!! I've done the R1s last race and they did ok ... But the H1 just seem to take the heat cycle so much better ... I race for 45mins so there's the potential for quite a bit of heat if I over drive the car ... The diff in the mini really did help that!!




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Again great info very helpful. Sounds like you doing it right, having fun and getting results.
No diffs in hot hatch class c unless fitted as standard and brake calipers must be standard.
Going to be an interesting winter, aiming to fit cage then see what happens after that.
Mallory for me on the 2nd for some practice. Currently fitted brake ducting and stripped interior, enough for me to get out and start learning.
Good luck sat.

 

[@Josh]

@GazzaCup
I am looking at the 750 motor club for next year, I was thinking of doing the 200bhp per tonne, I am getting my clio mapped at EFI on the 30th August I can give you an indication of power then on a standard engine.
I run standard engine with v6 Air box with a cold air feed. (hoping for around 180/185 after the map as the car feels strong) this combined with a car that weighs around 950 you are getting close to 200bhp per tonne probably around 193/195.
I could be totally off here with my maths but that was my plan.

Josh

 

[bloke]

I'd get the car on rollers for power figure and then get it weighed as it is first.

 

[Steven_K]

... Worth noting that I competed on Sat and weighed in 1091 kgs, I had declared 1090kgs #superclose [emoji106]


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[alistairolsen]

Also depends if its at the flywheel or wheels that they quote your power. A 182 wont make over 150 at the wheels anyway for example

 

[@Josh]

@GazzaCup i have been on the rolling road today and had the Clio mapped, it made 177bhp after the map (standard engine - Miltek exhaust + V6 air box) 151bhp at the wheels which isn't to bad I am told.
Do you know if the regs are power at the wheels or power at the flywheel?

 

[GazzaCup]

@GazzaCup i have been on the rolling road today and had the Clio mapped, it made 177bhp after the map (standard engine - Miltek exhaust + V6 air box) 151bhp at the wheels which isn't to bad I am told.
Do you know if the regs are power at the wheels or power at the flywheel?

Just checked regs, Flywheel.
So if I am in that ball park, got to get the car to 1180kg to make it 150bhpt.
Don't like the sound of adding that much weight.
Still not sure if the engine could be detuned by 10-15bhp.
Who did your mapping?

 

[@Josh]

Just checked regs, Flywheel.
So if I am in that ball park, got to get the car to 1180kg to make it 150bhpt.
Don't like the sound of adding that much weight.
Still not sure if the engine could be detuned by 10-15bhp.
Who did your mapping?

Chris at EFi Parts would highly recommend he has a website if you wanted to go and look.
So I am still aiming for 200bhp per tonne hopefully car is around 950 (yet to be weighed) let's see how we get on