is the ride on these things generally horrible? and suspension geo..

[poopipe]

I've had my ph2 a week or so now and have given it a good "testing". It seems well enough but the ride quality is pretty poo (I'm coming from a lowered mx5 on good quality shocks so I'm not expecting s-class bargery)

It's had new front shocks in the last year or two, the rears look fine as far as leaking goes. The springs are intact and it doesn't feel like anything's actually broken.

It sticks to the road alright, will c**k a leg under provocation and doesn't wander off or bounce but the steering does react pretty enthusiastically to bumps and it's really not very comfortable at low speeds on shite roads.

It feels a bit like the mx5 did when it was chronically overdamped (I was given the wrong base settings to work from).

Basically - are they all like this? Have I just been spoiled by having fully adjustable suspenders on my 5? or does something sound horribly, horribly wrong?

Also,

Is the Clio suspension geometry adjustable enough to warrant paying out for a proper laser alignment - if so, where would one go within an hour or so of Cambridge? I used wheels in motion for the Mazda but I don't think they've got much experience with clios.


ta

 

[poopipe]

sorry ,wrong section

 

[Gardus]

As it is, only the front toe in is adjustable on the clio. You can fit eibach/H&R front camber bolts, to increase camber at the front, and shims at the rear to modify both camber and toe in.
The steering of the clio gives lot of information, you can feel every bump, camber change and small imperfection. It's one of the good thing about the car, but it makes for a stressful ride. I found out that when you drive at legal speed it's better to have a "soft" grip at the wheel, the cars goes where you want even if the wheel moves a bit.

One thought: have you been driving RWD cars only for a while? The steering feel is so much pure and less crowded with info on a mx5, bmw etc...

Steering apart, it shouldn't be so much uncomfortable, is much better then my mini with 17" and eibach! Are you sure the rear shocks are ok? The springs are OEM (basically, is the car lowered?)?

 

[TimR26]

Have you checked the track rod ends, ball joints, bushes etc are all ok? Also rear dampers might be worn out even if there's no sign of leaking.

 

[Gardus]

I agree with atouba, i'm going to replace balljoints, bushes and dampers on mine.

 

[poopipe]

When I say horrible I'm comparing it to a properly set-up, fully adjustable suspension kit with the correct spring rates and so on. Over-stiff might be a better way to describe it -it's not crashy or anything, just hard.
It's not an issue at entertaining speeds, just seems it could've been set up better for lower speed driving.

gardus : I'm not at all used to fwd so that could well be a large part of the steering thing - your description pretty much covers my complaint so I imagine I'll just have to get used to it.

Everything's standard as far as I can tell - certainly doesn't look lowered, the springs are all in the right places and they're not lairy colours or owt. Can't be 100% on the shocks without whipping them off and I imagine 75k has taken a bit of a toll but they aren't exhibiting any signs of failure.

As far as the geometry stuff goes it looks like there's a few quid to spend before any significant handling tweaks can be achieved - I'll look into that sort of thing next year along with some proper suspenders.

atouba : good point and definitely worth a look, it's had a bunch of stuff changed in around there but i forget exactly what. I'll have to get it up on stands soon anyways so i can sort a rattly heatshield and will give everything a good poke then.



Thanks chaps, I think I'm just being awkward


edit: I think I'm also being dim. the 5 is on 13x7" wheels with 185x60 tyres so there's a horse load of tyre to soak up bumps before the suspension gets involved. I imagine this plays a large part.

 

[rory182]

MX5's are very adjustable aren't they, including caster?

I have just replaced my track rods and had an alignment and fitted camber bolts and it's night and day!

 

[poopipe]

yup, out of the factory the mk1 & 2 have caster, camber and toe up front, camber and toe at the rear. The range of adjustment is pretty substantial too.

did you go for a fancy alignment on one of them machine with the lasers? I love watching those.

 

[W17GLE]

i've just bought a ph1 172 and as standard it's 10 mph slower in fast corners than my vectra on coilovers. i think you have just been spoilt by your mx5 as they are brilliant little cars. i had eibachs on my old ph1 and it did improove things a bit.

allignment is every thing so just getting it all set up may make a big difference

 

[Alex_X93]

Eibach prolines 4xnew shocks, 2xcontroll arms, 2xinnner and outer rack ends, 4xantiroll bars bushes, 2xnew top mounts and 4xengine mounts should see you right

 

[poopipe]

I could run the 5 for another 18 months on that money


it probably is time to start digging around in there though - it's got 75k on it so something's bound to have worn out.

 

[DanDennehy]

As it is, only the front toe in is adjustable on the clio

and

yup, out of the factory the mk1 & 2 have caster, camber and toe up front, camber and toe at the rear

you can't both be right fellas so which is it?

oh yeah and the low speed ride is awful (way too stiff in bump/compression damping) but check your tyre pressures, they seem very sensitive to it

 

[Gaz_]

Toe. Rears cant be adjusted unless shims are used

 

[Alex_X93]

Check wheels are straight also ph1's suffer from easily buckled wheels makes them drive horrible especially at the rear. My guess would be that check weights and get local tyre place to spin alloys without tyres proberly like egg's!

 

[poopipe]

you can't both be right fellas so which is it?

we were talking about different cars - him the clio, me the mx5

oh yeah and the low speed ride is awful (way too stiff in bump/compression damping) but check your tyre pressures, they seem very sensitive to it

just what i needed to hear - especially since everything else seems fine (based on a half arsed inspection at least)

 

[-J-]

Just a quick note, WIM / Blackboots set my Clio up twice for me now, once for Brands Hatch track day I did and once when I had it set up for last winter.

They also had a cup racer in for set up when I was there. Personally would have no worries about them setting up the car.

 

[poopipe]

oh right - the chap there (not Tony, is it Tony jr? ) who's done my mazda a couple of times was kind of non-commital about clios when I asked if they got many in.

I'll stick with WIM then, I like it down there.

 

[DanDennehy]

I just checked out the WIM website, they seem to offer steering geometry checks as well as wheel alignment
Might pay them a visit myself seeing as my newly-aligned car doesn't track quite straight and the steering wheel is offset from centre
Speaking of which, anyone know what the geometry spec for a 2002 172 Cup should be?

 

[DanDennehy]

we were talking about different cars - him the clio, me the mx5

Ah OK - my bad, sorry!