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GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
@Akay
I used 8 AWG wire in my original set up a few years ago and it was more than sufficient. Use this site to work out as it depends on how long the wire run is. http://www.solar-wind.co.uk/cable-sizing-DC-cables.html
My personal preferance would be to install OEM wiring which you can retrieve from a 1.2 and 1.5 dci. This way you know it's the right gauge and you can also 60a fuse it in the original cars fuse box. This would mean using the r107 connector in the bulkhead. Second page in my thread kind of shows me doing this. http://www.cliosport.net/threads/grahams-summer-172-cup-track-car.768675/page-2 Otherwise run it straight to the battery.
The live can come from many places. I think a popular one would be the ignition as you say. Other places would be the cruise control wiring. If you see a yellow wire it's ignition controlled live in the loom.
I used 8 AWG wire in my original set up a few years ago and it was more than sufficient. Use this site to work out as it depends on how long the wire run is. http://www.solar-wind.co.uk/cable-sizing-DC-cables.html
My personal preferance would be to install OEM wiring which you can retrieve from a 1.2 and 1.5 dci. This way you know it's the right gauge and you can also 60a fuse it in the original cars fuse box. This would mean using the r107 connector in the bulkhead. Second page in my thread kind of shows me doing this. http://www.cliosport.net/threads/grahams-summer-172-cup-track-car.768675/page-2 Otherwise run it straight to the battery.
The live can come from many places. I think a popular one would be the ignition as you say. Other places would be the cruise control wiring. If you see a yellow wire it's ignition controlled live in the loom.
Akay
ClioSport Club Member
Clubman Cooper S
@GrahamS
Thanks, very helpful!
Do you think running it to the through connector and fused just before would be adequate if I were to use my 8awg wire? I will look into the DCI wiring, would it be a case of getting the dash wire from a scrappy or would I need to change my bulkhead plug to the engine bay loom?
Thanks, very helpful!
Do you think running it to the through connector and fused just before would be adequate if I were to use my 8awg wire? I will look into the DCI wiring, would it be a case of getting the dash wire from a scrappy or would I need to change my bulkhead plug to the engine bay loom?
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
You'd fuse at the start of the run so it would be at the end furthest from the PS ECU preferably before it enters the cabin.
For the OEM wiring you have to remove it from the dash loom of a car in the scrappies, put a pin in the interior side and then a pin in the exterior side. It's actually really easy as it's all generic placement in the factory bulkhead connector block. As the wiring isn't there from factory there is a space for you to put it in. I can get some diagram info for you later if you want.
Akay
ClioSport Club Member
Clubman Cooper S
@GrahamS that would be great if you could. Could you point me to the pins I would need?
So plug and wire from scrappies - pin to bulkhead connector interior side - pin to bulkhead connector engine bay side - run cable to fusebox and fuse it 50 amp from there? Or have you used an OE fuse connector?
Sorry for all the questions - I would prefer as OE an install as possible!
So plug and wire from scrappies - pin to bulkhead connector interior side - pin to bulkhead connector engine bay side - run cable to fusebox and fuse it 50 amp from there? Or have you used an OE fuse connector?
Sorry for all the questions - I would prefer as OE an install as possible!
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
You actually remove the wire and pins from the OEM connectors. It's possible to run a total OEM set up with oem pins, wire and fuse conenctors. There is a place in the engine bay fusebox to clip on the additional fuse. It's a 60a. Will get the wiring this afternoon for you when I'm home.
markmcgivern
ClioSport Club Member
RB 182 Cup
I'll be doing this next week so will come in very useful
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
Okay chaps here we are. I've put together an excel sheet with pin out details of the connector into the EPAS ECU. There's a diagram in there too which should be self explanatory.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7cmvsr40rrv37jp/Power Steering Wiring.xlsx?dl=0
To get the factory wiring it's pin e3 in the r107 which is a central spade connector. The 107 it behind the washer bottle and has a 10mm bolt in the skuttle to separate the internal and external part of it. To take the pin out of the block connector you need to pull the tabs out the side of the connector and press down a small tab on the pin it's self. If you can't source the oem wiring from a scrappies the factory cable size is 7mm^2. The internal part of the loom goes from the r107 accross to the EPAS ECU. It's also a good idea to take the ground wire and remove the plug and wires for the torque sensor and any of the option bits in the notes of the excel.
This is the EPAS 502 connector that comes with the epas control box. I've installed the optional EPAS light control wire and diagnostic CAN wire.
This is the bit you connect the CAN into if you're going to. It's on the part of the loom which goes down to the diagnostic part.
This is the block in the fuse box you attach the OEM wire to. The coloured sections come off so you just clip it on and the other part of the spade is already pre-wired and live.
Pic of the external part of the r107. The grey bit is the tab you need to remove to take out and insert pins. It locks them in place in addition to the tab on the spade.
This is how mine all sits
Inserting the wire into e3 of the external section of the r107
OEM plug for EPAS ECU (I've noted the different colours and what's not used by the ebay control box)
Wire externally from r107 to the fuse box should look like this. This isn't actually the original OEM correct wire so ignore the orange terminal colour.
Any questions just ask.
Graham
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7cmvsr40rrv37jp/Power Steering Wiring.xlsx?dl=0
To get the factory wiring it's pin e3 in the r107 which is a central spade connector. The 107 it behind the washer bottle and has a 10mm bolt in the skuttle to separate the internal and external part of it. To take the pin out of the block connector you need to pull the tabs out the side of the connector and press down a small tab on the pin it's self. If you can't source the oem wiring from a scrappies the factory cable size is 7mm^2. The internal part of the loom goes from the r107 accross to the EPAS ECU. It's also a good idea to take the ground wire and remove the plug and wires for the torque sensor and any of the option bits in the notes of the excel.
This is the EPAS 502 connector that comes with the epas control box. I've installed the optional EPAS light control wire and diagnostic CAN wire.
This is the bit you connect the CAN into if you're going to. It's on the part of the loom which goes down to the diagnostic part.
This is the block in the fuse box you attach the OEM wire to. The coloured sections come off so you just clip it on and the other part of the spade is already pre-wired and live.
Pic of the external part of the r107. The grey bit is the tab you need to remove to take out and insert pins. It locks them in place in addition to the tab on the spade.
This is how mine all sits
Inserting the wire into e3 of the external section of the r107
OEM plug for EPAS ECU (I've noted the different colours and what's not used by the ebay control box)
Wire externally from r107 to the fuse box should look like this. This isn't actually the original OEM correct wire so ignore the orange terminal colour.
Any questions just ask.
Graham
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
Akay
ClioSport Club Member
Clubman Cooper S
Wow, ridiculously helpful! Thanks for the time and effort doing that.
Il have a look tonight and sure will have some more headscratching!
Ive ordered this kit and it comes with a new plug to wire to!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/RENAULT-CLIO-2-MK2-Electric-power-steering-column-controller-unit-kit-epas-rally/262195433245?hlpht=true&ops=true&viphx=1&_trksid=p2050601.c100103.m2451&_trkparms=aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=20150422114059&meid=58f1a68457b84289b0bb1c5c0d47870e&pid=100103&rk=1&rkt=4&sd=262195433245&clkid=4398633434661851828&_qi=RTM2065550
Im assuming its a dash-out job to get to the bulkhead connector inside the car?
Il have a look tonight and sure will have some more headscratching!
Ive ordered this kit and it comes with a new plug to wire to!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/RENAULT-CLIO-2-MK2-Electric-power-steering-column-controller-unit-kit-epas-rally/262195433245?hlpht=true&ops=true&viphx=1&_trksid=p2050601.c100103.m2451&_trkparms=aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=20150422114059&meid=58f1a68457b84289b0bb1c5c0d47870e&pid=100103&rk=1&rkt=4&sd=262195433245&clkid=4398633434661851828&_qi=RTM2065550
Im assuming its a dash-out job to get to the bulkhead connector inside the car?
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
No worries
I've never seen that kit with all the extra bits so that's certainly a step up on what it used to be! That negates the need to get the torque sensor wiring from the car then. The kit isn't aimed at doing OEM wiring though so that fuse holder and the black plug would replace the fuse and main power wire you remove from the scrappies car.
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
Yeah certainly could do, it wouldn't be a worse set up at all. The pins aren't difficult to remove if you have a few small screwdrivers to pop up clips and lugs but you can't really remove the wire from the pin and replace it with new wire without damaging the pin. I think Renault might sell the pins but I could be total wrong saying that! If you use your 8 awg wire I'd run it through the firewall somewhere else.
Just fitted EPAS onto my car with cup alternator set up and looped rack, its great to lose all the PAS pipes etc.
However, its quite stiff when stationary, kind of like it goes back to a manual rack if at a stationary position and turning the wheel, do you think there is some kind of issue somewhere or is it the case with everyone's?
However, its quite stiff when stationary, kind of like it goes back to a manual rack if at a stationary position and turning the wheel, do you think there is some kind of issue somewhere or is it the case with everyone's?
Clio 172 Merc ML55
You're using the eBay variable controller I assume?
Yeah
Yeah pretty much, if the wheel is straight, i can turn to about 10 and 2 with little to no resistance, as soon as i try to turn any further than that there's resistance as if I had no PAS
Clio 172 Merc ML55
Everything wired up correctly? Only I know when I did mine the instructions didn't make complete sense and I think one of the wires was a different colour
How does it behave when driving too? Do you notice a difference in resistance if you move the adjuster when driving?
How does it behave when driving too? Do you notice a difference in resistance if you move the adjuster when driving?
I believe it is yeah, the wires on the torque sensor corresponded fine, just the purple one was more like violet but that shouldn't be an issue. While driving it feels okay, if I move the adjuster its not a crazy drastic difference although I probably haven't played with it enough and I figured it takes a short while to change (which i've been told is normal).
Also might be worth mentioning I think I tried to put it to the lowest setting to turn it off but it didn't feel as if it turns off fully.
Will have to double check all of this when I drive it next, what do you think I should be testing out? I will test it all and report back once I've tried it all
Clio 172 Merc ML55
I don't think it will fully turn off as there will always be some power there, there will be a slight delay between altering the setting if the adjuster (at least there is on mine anyway) but it might be worth going from minimum to maximum and see what differences there are.
Without being able to check voltages it's hard to be able to suggest anything for certain but one possibility could be a weak motor
Out of curiosity where abouts have you earthed the EPAS ecu?
Without being able to check voltages it's hard to be able to suggest anything for certain but one possibility could be a weak motor
Out of curiosity where abouts have you earthed the EPAS ecu?
I've looked at the voltages just via an OBD2 app through what the ECU tells me and it's mostly 14.4v even when turning the wheel, however chances are this voltage isn't the most reliable.
I earthed the both the ECU and the little receiver to one of the 4 column bolts, precisely the one closest to the cruise switches which I am currently doubting as to being a good earth. I found the receiver's earth quite tricky as the wire is so thin and there aren't many places to earth back there. Where would you suggest me earthing them?
Clio 172 Merc ML55
I've run the earth from the ecu to one of the dash support bolts and the smaller wire is run up to the drivers side earthing point on the dash support (one of the three bolts that doubles up to hold the top of the lower dash in place) not saying they're the best places but they've worked for me for a year
Checked earth and re adjusted to make sure, seems okay, while driving its working all fine too so not down to that.
What I have observed today is that at stationary, for it to actually kick in well enough and make steering lighter, I need to put the knob right near the max, which makes me think the issue is not too bad and is possibly due to how heavy the looped 182 rack actually is so just going to leave it as it is
172 Ph1
Mine is exactly the same as to what you are describing , I drive with in on max whilst moving around slowly , and then I have a liked setting for general driving , and when on the motorway driving to track it's about half way . Really does stiffen the feel to prevent it from being to twitchy as if it was set to any higher it'll feel awefully lite.
Clio k4j - Clio 200T
This is plenty of helpful tips!
A question for who installed this kit.
I've installed this kit a while ago (never fully tested as the car still being built) but I've noticed a weird behavior.. If I turn the knob to decrease the aiding all works well. If I turn the knob to increase.. It doesn't change. But if I turn off everything and on again it works on the choosed position... It has to work like that? (Hope to have explained well)
A question for who installed this kit.
I've installed this kit a while ago (never fully tested as the car still being built) but I've noticed a weird behavior.. If I turn the knob to decrease the aiding all works well. If I turn the knob to increase.. It doesn't change. But if I turn off everything and on again it works on the choosed position... It has to work like that? (Hope to have explained well)
Akay
ClioSport Club Member
Clubman Cooper S
Bit of a bump on this.
Had EPAS fitted for a good while but I have a horrible creak when turning the wheel, especially at low speed. If you have your foot near the column when turning you can feel it transmitting, almost pinging back if that makes sense. Any ideas? Is it likely to be the rack?
Had EPAS fitted for a good while but I have a horrible creak when turning the wheel, especially at low speed. If you have your foot near the column when turning you can feel it transmitting, almost pinging back if that makes sense. Any ideas? Is it likely to be the rack?
Ours creaks a bit as well but been through it from top to bottom and cant find where. iot s brand new rack all new bushes etc etc so have put it down to "settling in" it does seem to be reducing with every track day we do......
Clio 172 Merc ML55
What suspension are you running? Could be spring/top mount related
PH2 172
Another photobucket casualty.Okay chaps here we are. I've put together an excel sheet with pin out details of the connector into the EPAS ECU. There's a diagram in there too which should be self explanatory.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7cmvsr40rrv37jp/Power Steering Wiring.xlsx?dl=0
To get the factory wiring it's pin e3 in the r107 which is a central spade connector. The 107 it behind the washer bottle and has a 10mm bolt in the skuttle to separate the internal and external part of it. To take the pin out of the block connector you need to pull the tabs out the side of the connector and press down a small tab on the pin it's self. If you can't source the oem wiring from a scrappies the factory cable size is 7mm^2. The internal part of the loom goes from the r107 accross to the EPAS ECU. It's also a good idea to take the ground wire and remove the plug and wires for the torque sensor and any of the option bits in the notes of the excel.
This is the EPAS 502 connector that comes with the epas control box. I've installed the optional EPAS light control wire and diagnostic CAN wire.
This is the bit you connect the CAN into if you're going to. It's on the part of the loom which goes down to the diagnostic part.
This is the block in the fuse box you attach the OEM wire to. The coloured sections come off so you just clip it on and the other part of the spade is already pre-wired and live.
Pic of the external part of the r107. The grey bit is the tab you need to remove to take out and insert pins. It locks them in place in addition to the tab on the spade.
This is how mine all sits
Inserting the wire into e3 of the external section of the r107
OEM plug for EPAS ECU (I've noted the different colours and what's not used by the ebay control box)
Wire externally from r107 to the fuse box should look like this. This isn't actually the original OEM correct wire so ignore the orange terminal colour.
Any questions just ask.
Graham
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