Car Conked Out - Now Wont Start!

[Sam]

Hi CS'ers.

I was driving home from work today and my car just totally cut out. (2005 Reg, 182)

I drifted into a lay-by and then tried to start the car.

It sounded fine but it just didnt start. It turns over but thats it.

I opened the bonnet to check the belts and they where fine. Couldnt smell anything either. I have a quater tank of fuel so im hoping this aint the problem.

I lifted the rear seats, popped the black fuel pump cover off and turned the key and i could hear it prime so i guess its pumping fuel.

I obviously dont know if the fuel is getting to the engine or not.

Ive rang a few experts off here. One said it could be the crank set which is under the airbox isnt it ???

Another said it also could be the coilpacks ??

Ive got a spare coilpack and a crank sensor which im picking up in an hour.

I just want to know what else could it be ?

How do i fit a crank sensor ?

Is a coilpack easy to fit ?

Any information is greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,
Sam!

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Coil pack is a piece of piss mate, 4 bolts holding it down..

Is it the idle control valve you mean or is it definatley the crank sensor? (or are they the same thing?)

 

[Sam]

Coil pack is a piece of piss mate, 4 bolts holding it down..

Is it the idle control valve you mean or is it definatley the crank sensor? (or are they the same thing?)

Cheers Dan.

I rang BTM, didnt manage to speak to Fred but spoke to some other chap.

He said "Check the crank sensor under the air box near the radiator. Give it wiggle as sometimes they come loose".

I say 2 sensors, wiggled them both. I dont have a clue which is which. :/

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Mmm, unsure of the crank sensor mate. I'm sure someone will be along to tell you exactly where it is etc!

I cant imagine it'll be anything too serious!

 

[Sam]

I cant imagine it'll be anything too serious!

Famous last words. Ha.

Im hoping its nothing to big as well.

Thanks again!

 

[mark smith87]

It's probably crank sensor. Check the condition of the connector as well. It could be corroded. If it needs replacing you can get a repair kit from Renault.

 

[Sam]

It's probably crank sensor. Check the condition of the connector as well. It could be corroded. If it needs replacing you can get a repair kit from Renault.

Which one is the crank sensor mate ?

Im useless under there.

 

[mantis946]

Crank sensor is right on top of the gearbox where it meets the block, a tad out of sight and awkward to get to. If you have a volt meter check for voltage to the coilpack.

The item being tightened

 

[Sam]

Right, i do have a voltmeter so i will check that.

You say at the back on top of the gear box.

Can i reach this by sticking my hand right to the back of the engine where the coolant bottle is ?

 

[Sam]

The item being tightened

That does look a b**ch to get to.

If i remove my air box and cold air feed do i stand a chance ?

 

[mantis946]

Should be dandy just whipping the airbox off

 

[Matt Cup]

Right, i do have a voltmeter so i will check that.

You say at the back on top of the gear box.

Can i reach this by sticking my hand right to the back of the engine where the coolant bottle is ?

Take airbox off, should be easy to access then. 2 10mm studs holding it in.

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Just take the airbox out mate, it'll be easier to reach with that out the road!

 

[Sam]

Right, im going to do this.

Is it just 2 wires for this sensor ?

Can i also test this with a vault meter ?

Someone said something about a rusty connection, do i just clean it and put it back together ?

 

[Matt Cup]

Bit of emery paper on the tip of it.

 

[mantis946]

Single connector with 2 wires yeah, the loom was a bit iffy and common fault so Renault sold a new connector with loom (The sort KTEC sell)

From memory the loom on these run straight to the ECU, you could run a continuity test from one wire to the ECU pin but it would be a pain in the ass lol

 

[wrc172]

As a general rule, only 2 things needed to start a car. Fuel & Spark.

Sounds like the fuel side is ok as its priming ok etc, worth chucking a jerry can of fuel in there just to make sure your gauge isn't fault.

A straight dying like that does sound electrical, probs not coil pack as they generally break down slowly rather than just pop.


Deffo as advised, change crank sensor and wiring, easy job - ONE job on a 172 that is quite a lot easier than most cars! And it's one sensor that if fails will stop a car in its tracks.

 

[Dan519]

As I said on the phone, Crank sensor is possible, but that's unusual to conk out on you, they usually just give hot starting issues. Did you manage to plug in your RStuner?

 

[jenic]

Mine was crank sensor when it wouldn't start at all, so worth a try.

The loom kit thing they give is a ballache to fit due to the wiring, but due to the connectors they supply is easy to do.

 

[Sam]

As I said on the phone, Crank sensor is possible, but that's unusual to conk out on you, they usually just give hot starting issues. Did you manage to plug in your RStuner?

I have not manage to source one yet mate.

I have bought a Crank Sensor and a Coil pack so will try and get them fitted tomorrow.

Hoping it might be just a dodgey connection due to the amount of rain we have had today / weekend.

I guess we will see.

Thanks for everyones help though.

 

[Tunst]

Sam, im heading to newcastle tomorrow night, if you dont manage to get a code reader I can bring mine over with me and we can plug into the car?

 

[Sam]

Sam, im heading to newcastle tomorrow night, if you dont manage to get a code reader I can bring mine over with me and we can plug into the car?

That would be great mate.

Ill let you know how i get on.

 

[len_beach]

I'd say defo crank sensor or coil pack.

I died on my first track day, spluttered a little then cut out half a lap later. Got it going when it cooled down but it died again.

Found the crank sensor plug had broken so the wires were shorting plus the coil pack had broken down due to heat. Could be one or the other or a combination of both.

 

[Sam]

Right.

Ive change the coil pack and the crank sensor and it still wont start.

Ive tested from the coil pack to the battery and i was getting voltage (Around 10V from one of the prongs).

Ive been talking to Dan@519 and he told me to clean the relays and fuses in the engine bay which i have done and i sprayed some WD40 on them to make sure there was a good connection.

I then thought more about the fuel and disconnected the fuel line. Primed the car again and fuel came out so i know there is fuel there, and i know there is a spark.

I just dont understand why it wont start.

I guess it could possibly be a dodgey crank sensor again but i wont be able to make sure of this until i buy a brand new one from the shop tomorrow.

Is there anything else i could possibly try ?

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Have you had any issues with the starter motor mate? Theres no 'click' when you go to fire it is there?

 

[Sam]

Have you had any issues with the starter motor mate? Theres no 'click' when you go to fire it is there?

Its turning over mate, it just wont fire.

 

[Matt Cup]

Do you know anyone else with a 1*2? You could try their crank sensor.

 

[Sam]

I do yeh but he lives a bit away. Dont know how he would feel about me taking his out.

Im hoping Tunst might be able to pop down and plug it in if im not to far away.

 

[sophiesdad]

Check the earth cable as they can break and cause your symptoms.

 

[Sam]

Check the earth cable as they can break and cause your symptoms.

Where is the earth cables ?

Would this cause the car to not fire or do nothing at all ?

It turns over and ive tested a spark plug and it is sparking.

 

[sophiesdad]

Sorry , if your getting a spark , unlikely earth cable then , must of missed that part .
checked timing?
i will read the whole thread again and see what else I have missed

 

[Sam]

I dont know how to check the timing.

 

[Sam]

This is still bugging the hell out of me.

I'm now thinking of the worse.

If the cambelt has slipped, would it be able to crank??

It can constantly crank if I keep the key turned passed stage 3.

Like I said, its got fuel in to the fuel rail and I took a spark plug out and it was sparking.

I've been thinking;

What if somethings happend inside the fuel rail? IE, injectors blocked? Can this happen to all 4 at once?

Obviously the 2nd crank sensor could be at fault.

 

[Tunst]

Sorry i couldnt make it last night mate

Id be tempted to try another crank sensor just to be sure, but if your geting a spark and fuel then there should be no problems with starting.. To me its pointing towards timing slipping so the fuel and spark arnt in coordination... Might be worth getting that checked out...

 

[Sam]

Its no bother Tunst.

I think I'm starting to think towards that now.

I think ill buy a new crank sensor and try that.

 

[mantis946]

Could always try a compression test, think the kit is fairly cheap.

I know how you feel though, the exact same thing happened to my PH1 a few month ago.

 

[Sam]

I think Craigs got one so will have to test it at the weekend.

Hoping its nothing to serious.

 

[MartinR]

checked for voltage/spark at the plug end of the ht leads?

 

[Chip-mk1]

To start an engine needs
A roughly correct amount of fuel in with enough air
Decent strength spark with timing vaguely near to TDC
Compression



If you have spark, you have a crank sensor signal, you can use a timing light (30 quid tops from a local motorists store for a basic one) to make sure that the spark is consistantly timed etc.

Injector noids will tell you if the injectors are firing, again not expensive.

Compression test on the engine would show you if you belt has slipped and bent the valves, but you would hear the difference on cranking anyway if it had no compression.

 

[Chip-mk1]

checked for voltage/spark at the plug end of the ht leads?

Careful doing so, there is a LOT of voltage around there, can give you a nasty shock, dont go near it with a volt meter or anything like that.